[1]384-cr2oi6Groceries and theoretical physics Amazed at the
human body: Everyday stuff that's practically theoretical
physics complex: I collecting groceries to bring to the house.
Three large bottles of water with handles, opening up a bag and
putting loose items in, opening up the bag, and putting things
in while holding the bottles, configuring and reconfiguring the
positions of my fingers clasped around the handles of each,
shifting them around from one side to the other until I got the
perfect configuration where I could shut the door with a loose
elbow...
...and I thought to myself as I'm doing it, "How many
calculations would it take to figure out that *this* is one of
the optimum configurations of my fingers, hands, twists, elbows,
shoulders, in relation to my body in relation to each of the
items I'm carrying, and the steps I did to get there? What I did
was everyday. We all do it. Yet think how mathematically amazing
it is if we tried to get the formula to calculate all of that. I
don't think our brains do all of those calculations though.
There's a concept called Affordances, which makes a little more
sense to me. It's hard to grasp at first, but basically "things
find themselves in the optimum configuration at any given moment
given the circumstances they find themselves in". In short, they
do what they're able given the situation and changing as it the
situation changes. Everyday theoretical physics level math. ==
Oh yes there's definitely a kind of muscle memory, but consider
the relationship between the organism, its capabilities, its
task and the environment. That's what affordances touches on. It
goes beyond the organism and its neural activity and enters into
a mindset where we might think of robotics that are using
minimal computations to accomplish tasks. == Well, I think
that's part of it, but I think there might be a little more to
it in the case of optimum fitting situations. The ability to
gauge size and "fittingness" is something we can do in our
brains without physical objects present. Granted, it's something
we have trouble with when we're young - and some people never
overcome it. [the famous experiment of gauging liquid volume is
an example some people have trouble overcoming]
[2]
https://www.researchgate.net/.../Figure-1-Two... Yet, one of
the things that IQ tests famously measure is the ability to
rotate objects in 3D in the brain. Gauging how to move a couch
through a doorway for example: Some people can "see" how to
rotate it just right so that it will fit, without even having
had any experience moving. Other people will forever break the
frames around doors because they can never see it. And inbetween
the two extremes, some people learn through experience. So I
think likewise with using fingers/hands/wrists/elbows/shoulders
along with loose groceries, putting in bags, putting the hatch
of the car down. Much of it can be attributed to learned skill
of course. At the same time, when did we learn it? When we're
toddlers we carry our toys to and fro. We drop things. We pick
them up. We want to bring EVERYTHING with us at that age. Maybe
the learning primarily takes place at that point. That would be
the period of time that gets obscured by the age of 7 or 8, so
that the same memories of when they were 3 yrs old that are
available to an average 6 year old, are no longer available to
the average 9 year old. Amazing how in 2-3 years that there's
such a strong "forgetting curve", although it's not really
forgetting, but "incorporating". The event specifics may be
fuzzy or difficult to recall, but the memories have been encoded
in our emotional responses, our "automatic" muscle memories and
such. So, I think you're right and at the same time, I think a
lot of the encoding takes place extremely early. == Quite true.
I'm not knocking the ability of grown adults to learn new
skills: brain has tremendous plasticity. I've always had
coordination issues from when I was young: they had special
training for me when I was in that critical 1-4 yr old range to
overcome most of it so that I was able to enter regular school
without anything noticeable. But I think consequently, I'm extra
"conscious" of the positionings of my body. I can sit here and I
know what my 3rd toe on my right foot feels like at the same
time as my left eyebrow and the state of my intestines and how
my eyelashes are touching my glasses while typing and thinking
my thoughts and hearing a song playing in my head. Nothing
special about these things, but having a hyper-awareness of
muscle position and nerves at every given moment of any day I
think makes me appreciate the tremendous burden on babies and
toddlers in learning how to use their bodies properly. My
process had to be helped along, right into the 3.5/4 yr old
range, when the first adult-recallable memories will stay behind
firmly. [I have some from before that age but they're more like
dreams]. It takes a lot to ignore all the "input" from
everywhere and it's kind of annoying at times but I'm grateful
overall. == Please do: I enjoy this kind of stuff smile emoticon
I'm unfortunately excessively self-aware of my programming as it
operates: the subroutine that monitors an overview of functions
as they are happening is always displayed in the corner of my
conscious thought. So, while programmed, the status monitor is
the thing I have to ignore a lot: the control panel to modify
the automated systems is RIGHT THERE within reach and so, I
often mess with it in real time, sometimes to my detriment. For
example, while speaking. I'm conscious of speaking as I'm
speaking, conscious of muscle movements of my vocal chords,
positioning of tongue, so much so that I barely can think *what*
want to say, as my consciousness is wrapped up in the process of
speaking itself, trying to get everything right. I envy those
for whom these processes can be ignored and allowed to operated
"automatically" tongue emoticon Had a stutter when I was little.
3rd grade, speech therapy. Learned how to consciously control
mouth, tongue, throat, pause, think about positioning. It worked
great to fix the stutter. Created a little "pause" in my
consciousness, like an extra processing node of self-monitoring.
So, I suspect that little 'nugget' of extra processing space
remains. Closest thing I can figure. == Weird example: As I
walk, there's something akin to "this guy" in my head. I'm aware
of "me" as I'm moving, intentioning and all of that. But then
there's _this_ dude (something like that), which shows my center
of gravity, the placement of my feet, the pressure I'm pushing
down, the positioning of arms and hands. Head positioning I have
less of an awareness of but the rest is always there. Kind of
annoying because it's hard to ignore sometimes. Center of
gravity is like a nugget or floating ball in my middle somewhere
that floats around and moves and my body kinda works around it.
[and your post just showed up so I'll address that - here tongue
emoticon ] Well, you mention "where did these people get
programmed?" and that's the part where my way of thinking
diverges: I'm _too_ aware of programming attempts on me through
the years, where my biases come from, although I discover
forgotten ones all of the time, as I'm always on the search. So,
it's hard for me to see "other people" as running _fully_ on
automatic, but I can see when someone has acquired some habits
that can easily vanish when they're pointed out. == Oh I've
encountered the way of thought your talking about. I mean,
people _do_ run on automatic. But de-automating isn't difficult.
It's not de-programming to me, as I don't care to change
someone's political views. They have their reasons, some
rational and some irrational just as anybody and everybody has
rational and irrational bits. But you can tell if you've made
their automated process manual again if they speak to you as a
person. Even for a moment, if they can see you as a fellow human
being (and you can tell by tone, choice of words and such, and
that can be conveyed via text as well as any other means of
communication), then you can see their self-awareness of their
OWN processes and an awareness of yours. To me, if I can reach
that point even for a moment, I know I'm not taking to an
automaton but to a human and that is one of my strongest biases
of all: that we really ARE all human individuals and I make it a
quest to find "that human" within the automated responses. How
they behave when I'm NOT around? That's their business smile
emoticon ==
References
Visible links
1.
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2.
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