From spaf  Sun Nov 10 13:46:22 1985
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       id AA26188; Sun, 10 Nov 85 13:46:22 est
Date: Sun, 10 Nov 85 13:46:22 est
From: Gene Spafford <spaf>
Posted-Date: Sun, 10 Nov 85 13:46:22 est
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To: usenet-II
Subject: Administrivia
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Welcome to the Usenet-II mailing list.  A formal "Introduction and
Charge" will be mailed out later today or tomorrow.  This message is
intended to present some basic information and guidelines for this
list.

The idea behind any mailing list is to present a non-public forum for a
discussion of some topic by a limited number of participants.  When I
started soliciting people to discuss this topic (to be explained more
in the next posting), I anticipated 25 - 30 people on the list.
However, I got an overwhelming response from the backbone admins, and a
number of other people were recommended for invitation in one way or
another, and the list now stands at 50 people.  That shouldn't present
too many problems, but I think it important that we keep this number in
mind when posting things to this list (more on that below).

Since some of you have indicated that you haven't participated in a
mailing list before, let me cover some important points:

1) To post something to the readership of the list, mail your
submission to:
       ...!{akgua,decvax,hplabs,ihnp4,linus,seismo,ulysses}!gatech!usenet-II
(or look at the path taken to get this mail to you -- "gatech" speaks to
lots of other sites.)

Mail can also be addressed via CSNet or the Arpa Internet to (respectively):
       usenet-II@gatech        usenet-II%[email protected]

2) Requests for changes to your address, archives, etc, can be mailed
directly to me (spaf@gatech), or to the alias "usenet-II-request@gatech"
Please, *do not* mail simple administrative requests to the whole list!

3) Participants of the list with CSNet or Arpa Internet addresses may
wish to have me use those in the list instead of UUCP-based addresses.
If so, please bear in mind that "gatech" currently is contacted by the
CSNet relay only once or twice a day by phone, and mail through those
networks will probably be delayed more than similar UUCP-routed mail.
Similar considerations apply to submissions.

4) An archive of all articles posted to the mailing list will be kept
at "gatech".  If you want a copy of any past mail, just let me know
(mail to me as in #2, above).

5) There will be *no* editing or moderation of postings.  This is a
simple remailer type of list.  Spend a little extra time yourself to
edit your submissions and make sure that they are coherent.  At some
future date, we may wish to publish (to the net) selected portions of
our activity (with authors' permission), and it is important that the
material be at least moderately readable.

5) Anything mailed to this list is done so with the implicit permission
to show copies of it to members of the list.  As a basic ground rule,
assume that *NO* permission is granted to publish this material
anywhere else *until* the author(s) grant specific permission to do
so.  Authors retain exclusive copyright until assigned or waived --
this is a mailing exchange and *not* a public forum.

6) Keep in mind that the group represented by this list is interested,
experienced, and probably over-committed timewise.  The majority of
list members appear to be administrators of major sites, and many have
been on the Usenet since its start.  Therefore, try not to spend too
much time stating the reasonably obvious.  If clarification is needed,
it can be asked for and gotten via mail.  Don't quote long sections
from previous mail, either.

7) I probably don't need to include this, but for the record let me
point out that as intelligent, mature adults we have no need to flame
each other.  I have puposely invited individuals with different
outlooks, philosophies and needs to participate in this list because I
feel we need the depth and the challenge.  We do *not* need harsh
words.  We need creative input, even if it seems a little far-fetched
at first, or opposed to our own particular viewpoint. Please don't
"shoot from the hip" and cut down suggestions without a little thought,
and please be especially careful not to fall into the (bad) net-habit
of cutting down the poster simply because the posting is naive,
confusing, or just not to your liking. This is not like net-news --
please be a little more temperate in your postings.  The Usenet
etiquette guide written by Chuq is applicable here.


Okay, that covers the points I believe are important for any mailing
list.  If I missed any, please let me know.

As I mentioned above, I will be posting an "introduction" for this
list sometime later today or tomorrow.  Once that is out, someone
suggested that each member of the list post a short paragraph or two
about themselves and why they are on the list.  I don't think that
is too bad an idea, so, if any of you are interested, go to it.

We have a few people on the list who have participated in Usenet since
its inception.  Would one or two of you post a short history about how
Usenet came about and grew, and (if possible) some of the original
goals of the net?  If we have any Arpanetters familiar with the history
of the mailing lists there it would be nice to see the same for those.
And maybe someone could explain to us all about "notes"....

I will be out of town from Nov. 12 to Nov 19.  Mail directed to
me during that time will be answered as soon as I can after I return.

--gene

Following is the list of participants as of 1pm, 10 November 85:

Rick Adams <[email protected]>
Ken Arnold <[email protected]>
Larry Auton <[email protected]>
Steve Bellovin <[email protected]>
Mark Brader <[email protected]>
Liudvikas Bukys <[email protected]>
Dave C. <[email protected]>
Herb Chong <[email protected]>
Laura Creighton <[email protected]>
Richard Doty <[email protected]>
Jim Ellis <[email protected]>
Joan Eslinger <[email protected]>
Ray Essick <[email protected]>
Erik Fair <[email protected]>
Dan Forsyth <[email protected]>
Greg Fowler <[email protected]>
John Gilmore <[email protected]>
Ron Heiby <[email protected]>
Greg Hidley <[email protected]>
Hokey <[email protected]>
Mark Horton <[email protected]>
Byron Howes <[email protected]>
Curtis Jackson <[email protected]>
Jim Johnston <[email protected]>
Rich Kulawiec <[email protected]>
Robert Lake <[email protected]>
Paul Lutt <[email protected]>
Mike Lutz <[email protected]>
Jim Madden <[email protected]>
Jeff Meyer <[email protected]>
Ron Natalie <[email protected]>
Arthur Olson <[email protected]>
Mel Pleasant <[email protected]>
Scott Preece <[email protected]>
Frank Pronk <[email protected]>
John Quarterman <[email protected]>
Brian Reid <[email protected]>
Mike Rodriquez <[email protected]>
Jan Sanislo <[email protected]>
Glenn Scott <[email protected]>
Dave Sherman <[email protected]>
Greg Skinner <[email protected]>
Becky Small <[email protected]>
Gene Spafford <[email protected]>
Henry Spencer <[email protected]>
Dave Stewart <[email protected]>
Sid Stuart <[email protected]>
R. J. White <[email protected]>
Charley Wingate <[email protected]>
Greg Woods <[email protected]>


From spaf  Tue Nov 12 01:45:31 1985
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       id AA13370; Tue, 12 Nov 85 01:45:31 est
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 85 01:45:31 est
From: Gene Spafford <spaf>
Posted-Date: Tue, 12 Nov 85 01:45:31 est
Received-Date: Tue, 12 Nov 85 01:45:31 est
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: usenet-II
Subject: Introduction
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Introduction to Usenet II Mailing List
--------------------------------------

Let's consider, for a few moments, the current state of Usenet.
Backbone sites are dropping newsgroups and discussing ways of
automatically limiting volume.  There are almost as many different (and
often incompatible) versions of news transport software in use as there
are newsgroups (and there are far too many of those), and in some
groups the space occupied by the control information in each article is
nearly 2 times the contents.  A significant fraction of the sites
making up the network can't accomodate flexibility in naming, resulting
in awkward constraints on newsgroup naming.  There is strife and
hostility over when and how to create and delete groups, and the sheer
volume of postings is drowning sites.  In fact, the current volume of
postings *about* postings ranks in the top 3 topics in the news being
circulated this month. Posters are becoming ruder, maliciousness
abounds, and the general response to everything is "just try to make me
do it." Cancellation messages are being forged, "rmgroup" messages have
been forged, and articles and replies have been directed to the wrong
places on purpose.  Many sites can no longer handle the transport time
and costs, nor can they handle the storage and cpu loads.

Perhaps the analogy is trite, but it is like a cancer.  Where there
should be cooperation, there are contrary efforts.  Instead of working
together as a whole, the parts are fragmenting and working at
crosspurposes, if at all.  Basically, the Usenet is dying.  It has a
had a long and fruitful life, especially considering how it came about
and grew to its present form (not bad for some former shell files,
eh?), but its lifetime is limited.  Maybe Usenet has another year of
functionality left.  Maybe two at the outside.  If you believe the net
is still healthy and these are all little problems easily solved, then
perhaps this mailing list isn't for you.

What I'm hoping this list will be for, is to discuss what we have all
learned from the Usenet experience.  How can we take the software,
transport connections, and sheer human experience and form a better
system?  What is more, how can we craft a new system so it has some of
the best features of the current network, yet keep from growing in such
an undisciplined way?  In fact, maybe we even need to discuss if we
want such a network (note: I do, or I wouldn't be trying to organize
this).

I don't mean to sound gloomy.  This is intended to be a message of hope
-- of determination to not give up without a fight.   Butler Lampson
has stated a few times in his papers on OS construction that you should
always build a system twice -- the first time just to make it work, and
the second time to do it right.  I think that applies here.  I'm keen to
try to do it right (and that isn't in any way intended to slight the
efforts or work of others that has gone into the current Usenet).

Let me tell you why I decided to start this group now (I should really
wait until I finish my thesis and have time for stuff like this).  I've
been thinking about the future of the net for about 2 years now.  I've
always been intrigued by the idea of what this kind of communication
resource can bring to people.  I've gotten some ideas about what could
come next, and I've discussed those in mail with some of you before.  I
ran a mailing list on those ideas about a year ago (or was it two?)
which was possibly a bit before its time.  Recently, elements of those
same ideas have come up again, in mail among the backbone sites with
Mark Horton suggesting we divide the namespace in a different manner,
and with Mark Brader (I believe -- I didn't save the article)
suggesting a cutover to new software by force at the backbone.  It's
odd how the same ideas can come up again and again (and independantly,
too).  While the ideas are fresh and there is a lot of enthusiasm, I
feel it is time to discuss some of these ideas in a larger group to see
if they can be of use.  Hence, this group.  If we come up with
something worthwhile, we can present it to the net.  For now, though, I
think we'd make better progress by keep the discussion limited to some
relatively small number of interested individuals.

Basically, what I'm suggesting we do is along the following lines:

1) Assume, if not for real, at least for the purposes of this list,
that Usenet in its present form will not last and that we are going to
try to design a worthwhile alternative.  We need to adopt this as our
"ground" and then proceed from there.  We must assume that we are going
to take all our knowledge and experience with the Usenet and other
communications mediums and develop a whiz-bang system which we will
call Usenet II. (Son of Usenet?  Beyond the Valley of the Usenet?)

2) Define and write down *precisely* what we would like Usenet-II to
be -- software exchange, technical resource, entertainment, creative
outlet, or just wide-ranging experiment.  This has to be a set of
purposes that each of us, as individuals and as quasi-representatives of
the sites which will support the network, must see as worthwhile and
workable.  We should then come up with some common intention list
which can serve as the preamble to a Usenet II "charter."

3) Define a set of characteristics of the structure defined in (1)
above.  This would include things like support for sequencing
discussions, keywords, graphics in signatures, tree structures for
topics, archiving, limits on followups, how to post sources (if at
all), and so on. One very important characteristic is that we recognize
and support the idea of regional (company, organization, continent)
topics and distributions as well as world-wide topics. This all should
take into account the current software environment where we hope to run
Usenet II, the transport and storage limitations, and most especially:
the limits on how much software can be developed for support in a short
amount of time with volunteer labor.

4) Codify a set of "rules" which reflect 1 thru 3.  Included with this
would be procedures on starting new groups (or discussions or mailing
lists or whatever), deleting old groups, dealing with malicious users,
and so on.  We should also describe some representative body and/or
"officers" who can help modify and implement these rules in the future,
as necessary.  This codification would be a semi-formal "charter" or
set of guidelines for the Usenet II which would have to be agreed to by
any site wishing to join.  There would be no compulsions in these
guidelines, and no formal organization formed.  There would, however,
be a document (like an RFC) to which we could refer quibbles and
problems, and by which we can define "conformant" sites.  We might wish
to make that statement stronger, but I'm not certain how.

5) Develop a common set of transport and storage formats for the new
net.  Develop a system that can be transported in compressed format,
that doesn't have 14 character name limits, and which won't require
hundreds of hours of cpu time a week in delivery and upkeep.  This
should include the possibility of tying in Arpa Internet sites, too.

6) Develop a set of reading and posting programs for (5), possibly
derived from some or all of the current popular software packages.
Include with this development a set of formal documents describing
how to use the software and the net itself.

7) Define a set of groups/topics/keywords/lists to start Usenet II with.
These should be consistant with our intents for the network, and
our perceived interests.

8) Set up a small network of sites (probably drawn from people on this
list) to test the software and refine everything in steps 1 thru 7.

9) Start adding new sites in a manner consistant with 1-4.  If those
sites want to continue with some or all of Usenet, fine.  If they wish
to drop Usenet in favor of the new network, also fine.  We will not
present anyone with an "either or" situation.


Does that all sound radical enough?  I hope so...I don't think
continuing with "business as usual" is going to do anything other than
allow the situation to deteriorate further.  And I, for one, do not
intend to devote any more of my time or creative energy to trying to
salvage the current situation.  With all that I have seen lately, I
don't think the reality is worth saving -- it has degenerated too far.
I love the idea, though, of a world-wide community able to communicate
and share their thoughts.  I would like to help develop what I have
seen a glimpse of in some of the Usenet groups.

So, tell me, is the idea crazy?  Am I being too negative about the
current situation?  Or is there a possibility that we could do this
thing?  If so, is it worth doing?  And do you want to be a part of it?
Would you be willing to contribute to the effort?  These are the first
topics of discussion.  Let's hear your comments and ideas.  If you
think I'm wrong, say why.  If you think I'm on the right track, suggest
something towards the next step.  I've had my say to open the
discussion -- now it's your turn to pontificate.


--gene
11/11/85

From cbosgd!cbpavo.cbosgd.ATT.UUCP!mark Tue Nov 12 14:59:16 1985
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From: [email protected] (Mark Horton)
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I agree with Gene.  I think the time has come to create an alternative
network, one without the history of Usenet to drag it down ("But we've
always done it THIS way") and with some of the mistakes corrected.

We have to think about some important issues, in addition to the ones
Gene lists.  For example:

Scope.  Is this new network internation, or is it limited to the USA?
If USA, what provisions do we make for peer networks in other countries
to connect in to us?  (It may seem obvious that it should be world-wide,
but there are regulations about international traffic and concerns about
ARPANET gateways that make it look simpler to have each country have their
own network.)

Control.  Right now Usenet is an anarchy.  Some argue that this is its
best feature, others that it's the fundamental problem.  How much centralized
(or distributed) control should there be over the new network, and how
is it enforced?

Resources.  The new network will have to be higher quality, and it will
probably not be able to exist with just volunteer effort.  There will
have to be people who spend significant amounts of their time doing
things like software development, support, administration, moderation,
testing, and consulting.  Where do these resources come from?

Funding.  There are expenses for people time, machines, communications costs,
travel expenses, etc.  Also, part of the problem with Usenet is that, since
it's free, people have no incentive to ration their use of the net.  WHere
does this money come from?


I spent 10 days in Korea and Japan last month, and got to talk to the
people who run several other academic networks at length.  I talked to
Dan Oberst about BITNET and Mailnet, to Larry Landweber and Dave Farber
about CSNET and NSF/NET.  I learned quite a bit.  Let me try to pass some
of this information along.

One observation is that there is a decided difference in quality between
CSNET and UUCP.  CSNET provides better service, and it costs more.  (There
were people who felt that CSNET's PhoneNet isn't necessarily better than
UUCP, but each has its own advantages.  It seems that, from the user's
perspective, the primary advantage to CSNET is that mail is more reliable.)
However, watching the users, they listened politely to the CSNET and NSF/NET
talks, but it was Usenet and UUCP that really lit their eyes up and got
them going.  The reason seemed to be that UUCP is lower cost and therefore
more of them can afford it.  Lower cost, lower quality things will penetrate
the market better than higher cost, higher quality things.  Of course, if
the costs are similar, the higher quality will be preferred.  It's the same
reason there are zillions of Commodore 64's out there.

If we were charging for this traffic, we'd be in fat city right now.
There would be lots of money to pay for expenses and improvements.
However, since we aren't charging, the extra traffic is just a headache
to us, in fact, the sites that run their machines the best are rewarded
by being bombarded with traffic (and with high phone bills.)  This has
caused research, allegra, and akgua to pull out.  decvax has cut back.
seismo is already looking for ways to cut back, so is cbosgd.

Mailnet has similar functionality to UUCP.  It works over dialup phone
lines, and the primary purpose is sending mail.  The technology is a
bit different - it uses MMDF to place the phone calls, and speaks SMTP
over the line once it gets connected.  It also is a star network, with
MIT-MULTICS as the hub.  Finally, it's not UNIX specific, but rather
there are implementations for several operating systems.

Mailnet was started from scratch about 18 months ago.  They looked at
the other networks and learned from their mistakes.  Mailnet started
out with a central administration and membership dues.  These dues pay
for the central administration (it's run by EDUCOM, which is a non-profit
corporation that already existed.)

BITNET started out the same way UUCP did - as a freewheeling, anarchistic
network.  It has totally different technology, however.  For a new site
to join in, they have to buy one leased line from their own machine to
the nearest machine that's already on.  They must also agree to let one
or two new members connect to them.  (Sounds a lot like Usenet, right?)
Since they don't add redundant links, BITNET is a tree (no loops) and
everybody but the original machine pays for exactly one leased line.
The leased lines are at 9600 baud, and cost typically a few hundred
dollars per month.  Their bills are fixed, since there is no charge
for traffic.  They use a protocol called RSCS, which causes each machine
to look like a remote card reader/punch to the other machine.  They
communicate by reading in "decks of cards" on each others virtual
card readers, these become batch jobs in the IBM queue.  (It is not true,
however, that BITNET is only an IBM network, there are BITNET sites running
UNIX, VMS, MTS, and a few others, I think.  But IBM dominates, much the
way UNIX dominates Usenet.)

BITNET is about 5 years old.  It is interconnected with some other networks
which speak the same protocol, including VNET (IBM's internal network),
EARN (the European version of BITNET), NetNorth (the Canadian version),
and a version in the Pacific region (Asia, Australia, etc) is about to
start up.  The connections with VNET are quite weak, but the other nets
share the same name space and appear to the user as one network.

About a year ago, BITNET got a grant from IBM to improve things.  This
grant went for a huge IBM mainframe (3081, I think) for the hub (CUNY)
for support and development, plus a staff of a dozen or so people to
do development, support, and administration.  I think the amount was
originally around $2,000,000 (half for the mainframe) and it is expected
to overrun to about $3,000,000.  It was to last two years, after which
time BITNET becomes self-sufficient.  (Meanwhile, IBM is also funding
the efforts in Europe, Canada, and Asia in similar and separate ways.)

The existing BITNET sites were just places connected in, they were not
formally members of any organization.  (Just like Usenet and UUCP.)
The new organization, also run by EDUCOM, has created a formal membership
system.  As an incentive to join, they provide services to the members,
such as a newsletter and a map.  Nobody is forced to join, but it's made
very attractive because all the bills for the first two years are picked
up by the grant.  After the grant runs out, charges are levied to members.

CSNET started up with an NSF grant for 5 years, after which it was to
become self sufficient.  Nobody really expected it to, but it's now 5
years later and CSNET actually has a surplus.  As Landweber puts it,
"People have voted with their money."  However, CSNET has no formal
corporation (other than a board of directors) and has affiliated with
an existing corporation (NCAR, I think) for bureaucratic purposes.  For
example, the CSNET staff is paid by NCAR, and the dues collected go into
a fund at NCAR.  It is not clear to me that the income and expenses are
necessarily tied to each other; I got the impession that NCAR would be
willing to fund some CSNET activities separately when the NSF grant runs
out.  The major problem with CSNET in the past has been high dues ($30,000
for corporations, $5000 for universities, each year.)  As you could predict,
mostly universities joined, and companies paying $30K/year became rare and
highly sought after.  Only a few, such as AT&T, HP, Tektronix, Sperry,
and Boeing joined.  Recently CSNET has adopted a sliding scale for
companies, down to $5000/year for a 100 person company.  They realize that
they won't get many UUCP members (which include a lot of startups) at
those rates, and are thinking of extending the scale to perhaps $1000/year
for a one person consulting company, such as Dave Farber's.

CSNET is starting up a new network, called Cypress.  This is a TCP/IP
network based on 9600 baud leased lines and SLIP.  It would be eventually
funded along the lines of BITNET - each organization buys one leased line.
The map in Landweber's talk shows four current sites: Purdue, Arizona,
DECWRL, and BBN.  Three lines exist, with Purdue on one end of all three.
Also, BITNET is moving toward TCP/IP.  In the long term, everybody wants
to use OSI, however.  (When academics say "OSI" they mean TP4/IP, which
are nearly clones of TCP/IP.)

One other thing I learned is the notion of "getting money out of
companies."  You can view the entire dues structure of CSNET as a way
to get companies to fund CSNET.  They took it a step further: CSNET is
a USA only network, with peer networks in other countries.  AT&T is
paying big bucks to CSNET, and doesn't want to feel that AT&T is
subsidizing big companies like the telcos in Japan.  So it is expected
that any company in Japan that wants to communicate with the USA CSNET
will pay the membership fee to CSNET (in addition to whatever it pays
the Japanese net.)  AT&T will be happy to reciprocate and pay the fee
to the Japanese network.  This is really just a way to get more money
out of the various companies.  (If this somehow seems immoral to you,
let me point out that the way Usenet operates isn't that different,
just on a smaller scale.  All the communications costs are hidden in
the phone bills.  In effect we've gotten the companies to fund Usenet.)


By the way, when I think of a new, wonderful network to replace what we
have now, I think of something that replaces both UUCP and Usenet.  Both
suffer from the same sorts of problems.  There could be considerable
synergy from using one set of resources to solve both problems.

So when we're looking for a way to start a new network, one thing we should
be thinking of is to get a grant from somebody to get started, and then to
gradually phase into a charging mode when the grant runs out.  These charges
need not be high, they need not be aimed at making a profit.  But they
should be high enough to cover our expenses, and to provide an appropriate
incentive (whatever that means) to the users to make "proper use" of the
facilities.  (For example, enough to get a user to make a decision "do I
really want to send this or am I just wasting resources, or is there a more
economical way to do it?")

Possible sources of grants:  AT&T (to compete with IBM), Usenix, the federal
government.  (If I stretch a bit I can picture DEC, HP, Tektronix, or Sun
in this role, but these seem a bit less likely.)  Obviously IBM stuff costs
a fortune, and we could do it for a lot less than $3M.

I can picture a backbone network of small UNIX boxes (possibly Suns or
3B2's or the new IBM RISC workstation) speaking TCP/IP/succ(SLIP) (there
are a couple of enhancements to SLIP needed) with leased lines which are
paid for out of overhead.  (This provides a positive incentive to be on
the backbone, rather than the current negative incentive.)  These UNIX
boxes would be dedicated gateways, so load on them doesn't matter.  They
are sort of like ARPANET IMPs, but more powerful, programmable in C, able
to use existing tools like TCP/IP and SLIP, but with 9600 baud links instead
of 56K.  (We could upgrade individual links to 56K as needed later.)
A second class of sites, called "primary" members, would buy a leased line
to the nearest backbone site or other primary site.  A third class of sites
who cannot afford a leased line would run a dialup version of TCP/IP/SLIP,
using 2400 baud modems (maybe even 9600.)  And finally there would be
nonmembers, who have the old stuff and are basically on their own.

On top of this transport service, we would provide some sort of communication.
This includes electronic mail and something like netnews.

Also, I should point out that we do have the option of doing this in
cooperation with CSNET, or in competition with it.  Both options are
viable and should be considered.

       Mark

From akgua!sdcrdcf!RDCF.SDC.UUCP!glenn  Wed Nov 13 01:44:57 1985
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From: sdcrdcf!RDCF.SDC.UUCP!glenn (Glenn C. Scott)
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Some thoughts...,

 I agree that it would be very nice to use these pre-existing transport
services or even to start a new one.  But my first thoughts while reading
about these various nets and such were "How am I going to do this ?".
While SDC is cooperating with USENET as a backbone site, I doubt very much
that I could get the money to subscribe to CSNET.  In this case CSNET
requires a capital expense, not just overhead costs (slush) as we now pay for
the bills.  It's going to take some smooth talking to get that one through.

 In planning the transport mechainsm I would like many different types of
mechanisms working together.  That way sites can join based on what they can
pay for, or what they already have.  For example SDC is available through
TYMNET, I would like to bleed that for all its worth.  SDC has two dedicated
56Kb line from Santa Monica, CA. to Paoli, PA. and McLean VA. that must be
useful for something, (we're still trying to find out what ;-)).  SDC is on the
ARPANET, etc., etc.

 I don't want to sound like I want the future USENET to be based on UUCP or
some other *old* technology.  But I do think that compatibility with many
systems is important.  If we start using specialised hardware or expensive
networks we might find USENET too expensive for other reasons than we have now.

Glenn


From [email protected]  Wed Nov 13 16:03:21 1985
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Date: Tue, 12 Nov 85 10:40:41 EST
From: Charley Wingate <[email protected]>
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: usenet-II%[email protected]
Subject: Intro and What I Want
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This is my introduction to the list, and my list of what I'd like to get
from the new system.  My name is indeed Charley Wingate, and I'm a graduate
student at U. of Maryland College Park, about to get my MS (and hopefully,
about to get into the PhD program).

Most people know me as a poster in the religion and philosophy groups.  I
would like to see them survive.  I would also like to see them become forums
for discussion, rather than serve as platforms for diatribes.  I'd
especially like to see the size of postings go down.

I also read a selection of hobbyist and technical groups; in the former case
chiefly net.railroad, rec.wood, and (until recently) sf-lovers; in the
latter case, mostly net.lang and micro.cpm.  All of these are plagued for me
by a lot of garbage which is diffcult to filter out.  The hobbyist groups
tend to have a lot of duplicate postings; the technical groups tend to
digress into uninteresting side issues.  The survivors are those for which
the task of weeding is not too arduous.

My perspective on this is as a user.  I know nothing about the
communications involved in the system.  I'd be willing to tolerate a LOT of
garbage floating around-- as long as I could avoid having to read it, or
even have to pick it out by hand as much as I do now.

That's about it for now.

Charley Wingate   umcp-cs!mangoe

From akgua!packard!ihnp4!utzoo!henry  Wed Nov 13 19:32:41 1985
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From: packard!ihnp4!utzoo!henry
Subject: Re:  Introduction
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> One observation is that there is a decided difference in quality between
> CSNET and UUCP.  CSNET provides better service, and it costs more.  (There
> were people who felt that CSNET's PhoneNet isn't necessarily better than
> UUCP, but each has its own advantages.  It seems that, from the user's
> perspective, the primary advantage to CSNET is that mail is more reliable.)

It should be mentioned that there are CSNET users who would dispute this
claim of high reliability.  I'm not a CSNET user and am not familiar with
the details, but I do know that not everyone agrees with the rosy view held
by its implementors and organizers.  We should beware of emulating existing
networks without investigating their flaws as well as their advantages.

                               Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
                               {allegra,ihnp4,linus,decvax}!utzoo!henry



From linus!utzoo!henry  Fri Nov 15 05:57:07 1985
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From: <linus!utzoo!henry>
Posted-Date: Fri, 15 Nov 85 05:55:23 est
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References: <[email protected]>
Subject: a dose of heresy
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One mistake we should avoid is the dreaded second-system effect:  trying
to erect a beautiful edifice that will solve all the world's problems,
and of course finding it necessary to employ all sorts of new and sexy
but untried ideas.  The surest way to kill Usenet II is to be too ambitious,
ending up with either a beautiful but complex design that nobody has time
to implement, or an elegant and beautiful structure that is fatally flawed
by nasty practical realities.  Let us not throw the baby out with the
bathwater:  Usenet has some major flaws, but it has coped moderately well
with a user community and a load far larger than anyone ever expected.

Case in point...  It is fashionable to criticize the concept of "newsgroups".
My contention is that the underlying concept -- a relatively modest number
of well-defined categories which is *not* subject to extension at the whim
of Joe Random User -- has served us well and should be kept in some form.
Lauren's objections to keyword-based news systems seem cogent to me:  it is
vital to have categories established by an authoritative mechanism rather
than a quasi-random free-for-all, so that everyone agrees on the naming
and organization of categories.  Note that this fits in well with moderation,
since moderators are discrete entities with sharply-defined permanent
boundaries (their skins!) between them.

This is not to say that the existing scheme is perfect!  The category space
has grown in an ad-hoc and messy way, despite occasional attempts to clean
it up somewhat.  And existing software does not do a terribly good job of
supporting the notion of "discussions" as separate entities within (and
sometimes across) newsgroups.  Note that supporting discussions implies
not only connecting articles into a sequence, but also breaking that sequence
to start a new one when the subject changes seriously.  (Or at least changing
the damn Subject line!)  Another role for moderators?

Another case in point:  uucp.  Troublesome though it is, replacing uucp
with another mechanism that will do as good a job of exploiting our primary
means of communication -- phone lines and autodialers -- will *not* be a
small task.  And it is not at all clear to me that it is justified.  (The
stuff that sits on top of uucp is another story.)  If we do need a new
transport mechanism, we should use the ACSNet stuff rather than setting
out to re-invent the wheel yet again.  Building a new transport mechanism
would be a major diversion of effort.  Considering our objectives, I do not
see that this would be anything but a stupid waste of our time and a major
opportunity for failure.

Third case in point:  dialup lines.  Simply because they can be justified
for other, popular, purposes, it seems to me that dialup lines are likely
to remain the primary communications medium for most sites, pious good
wishes notwithstanding.  It's hard to be cheaper than "free", and the
hardware we need for using phone lines tends to be effectively free because
it is justified for other jobs.  Do not underestimate how difficult it is
for many sites to justify capital expenditures, even modest ones.  By using
dialup lines, we get a major and important "free ride" for communications
hardware.  This is not to imply that the whole network needs to be built
using dialups, just that they will remain the rule rather than the exception.
We must live with this rather than futilely insisting that it change.

                               Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
                               {allegra,ihnp4,linus,decvax}!utzoo!henry


From akgua!packard!ihnp4!utzoo!lsuc!msb  Sat Nov 16 19:07:17 1985
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From: packard!ihnp4!utzoo!lsuc!msb
Subject: Danger of backbone-enforced cutover
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This was mailed to me by Lauren Weinstein ({ihnp4,...}!vortex!lauren);
I took the last paragraph as permission to forward it to the Usenet-II list.

(Begin message forwarded by Mark Brader)

I've been out of the country for two weeks and am trying to pick
this up by context... but I think I know what you're talking about.

Be warned.  I've gotten messages from people who have threatened
to do everything in their power to WRECK both Usenet and the mail
network if restrictions are put in.  Nor is it clear to me that
you'll ever be able to detect all the possible renegades or get
cooperation to cut them off.  The most likely result is fragmentation.
Nor am I thrilled at the prospect of trying to get people, on the
infinitely varied sorts of machines, to try run and support new
news software at this point.

I think a much simpler suggestion would be to simply create moderated
groups and encourage the backbones to stop transmission of the more
abusive non-moderated groups.  Random newgrps and such
could be dealt with through other simple means.  So long as the backbones
cut off the crap, the impact on the rest of the net will be
significant and won't require major changes for most sites, many of
whom are in no position to change much of anything without risking
a complete netnews cutoff and massive local outcry.

In other words, I think the backbones have the power to help this
situation without getting us into a situation where fragmentation
and new problems would seem a likely outcome.

This is just a quick note on this topic, I'll expound on this
in depth if/when this reaches a public forum.  I'm afraid that
Usenet II would just create more chaos and problems than it would
cure, given the real world situation.  I'm in favor of solutions that
involve changes at the fewest sites possible--and that means the
backbones.  More on this later.

Please forward this to the other interested parties on your list.

Thanks.

--Lauren--




From seismo!polaris!herbie  Sun Nov 17 01:33:51 1985
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Subject: hello, world
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i guess accepting an invitation to be on this mailing list means i'm
one of the "backbone cabal" 8-).  first, some bio-stuff so you know who
you're talking to.  for some of you who read net.audio and
net.games.rogue, i'm a familiar figure, and occasionally i make forays
into net.arch.  currently, i work for IBM designing and implementing
operating systems on their large processors (i.e., bigger than
4300's).  i only started here a while back.  before this, i was at the
U of Waterloo (hi rj) getting my Master's among other things.  i am
also about the only person from IBM who has approval (very unofficial)
to post to USENET.  i have been a systems programmer on MVS, VM, and
4.2bsd systems, though not always a very good one.  i have both my
degrees in Systems Design Engineering (one of the fuzzy fields).  i
subscribe to some 70 newsgroups these days.  i used to subscribe to
about 130 before i decided that i was spending too much time reading
news.  anyway, some comments on the postings to the mailing list to
date.

>From Gene Spafford (The Introductions):
>If you have been following any of the discussion in the net.news groups
>recently or if you administer a well-placed news site, you are
>undoubtedly aware that there are a number of nasty problems associated
>with the current state of the Usenet.  We have problems with
>signal:noise, transmission costs, transmission delays, naming space,
>etiquette, deciding what groups to carry, when to create and delete
>groups, etc., etc., etc.

>My
>intent is for us to come up with some kind of group insight into the
>nature and future of a net we would be willing to support -- with our
>time, our machines, and our money.  Once we have a set of parameters so
>defined, we can propose it to the net at large for comment and
>clarification.

perhaps i'm joining this discussion late, but aren't what you are
describing symptoms of a deeper problem?  there is something causing
the increase in net traffic.  is it just the number of sites (and
therefore the number of people) increasing, or are people posting
more?  noise in newsgroups is caused by what?  is it a lack of
knowledge?  is it also the high turnover in the people who read and
post?  how much of the problem is people-related rather than
hardware-related?  i don't want to be fixing the wrong problem.
supposing that we identify the problem correctly, but decide we can't
treat it, only its symptoms, we will at least have a way of predicting
the direction that the next set of problems will come from with better
accuracy.

>2) Define and write down *precisely* what we would like Usenet-II to
>be -- software exchange, technical resource, entertainment, creative
>outlet, or just wide-ranging experiment.

i would prefer that to be a long-term goal.  right now, i want to
understand the problem.  designing a network at all levels from the
bare metal to the user interface is a tall order.

>4) Codify a set of "rules" which reflect 1 thru 3.
>There would, however,
>be a document (like an RFC) to which we could refer quibbles and
>problems, and by which we can define "conformant" sites.

there naturally would have to be an amendment procedure in place from
the beginning, as well as an appeal procedure for decisions.  this
sounds like a constitution.

>From Mark Horton (about issues):
>Scope.  Is this new network internation, or is it limited to the USA?
>If USA, what provisions do we make for peer networks in other countries
>to connect in to us?

a properly defined network and software can be interfaced to by
anyone.  limiting the scope to north america will not cause problems
provided the interfaces are adequately described and we use
hardware/software that is not radically different from existing ones.
enforcement of intranet standards for internet communications can be
easy, or it can be hard, depending on the fragility and the flexibility
of the network.

>Control.  Right now Usenet is an anarchy.  Some argue that this is its
>best feature, others that it's the fundamental problem.

Chong's Conjecture: small anarchies work, big ones become something else.

>Resources.  The new network will have to be higher quality, and it will
>probably not be able to exist with just volunteer effort.  There will
>have to be people who spend significant amounts of their time doing
>things like software development, support, administration, moderation,
>testing, and consulting.  Where do these resources come from?

can a nonprofit organization take over the role of the backbones?  $$$$
and legal issues come in, as well as the problems of selling the idea
to the people who control the $$$$ for backbone sites.

>BITNET started out the same way UUCP did - as a freewheeling, anarchistic
>network.  It has totally different technology, however.  <...>
>They use a protocol called RSCS, which causes each machine
>to look like a remote card reader/punch to the other machine.  They
>communicate by reading in "decks of cards" on each others virtual
>card readers, these become batch jobs in the IBM queue.  (It is not true,
>however, that BITNET is only an IBM network, there are BITNET sites running
>UNIX, VMS, MTS, and a few others, I think.  But IBM dominates, much the
>way UNIX dominates Usenet.)

the details are wrong, but that doesn't matter.  RSCS is a file and
message transfer protocol built on as part of the VM operating system.
a user logged in is a virtual 370 with all the facilities of a real 370
and a whole lot that aren't.  there exist exactly two types of files in
RSCS:  card images, and print images.  now this seems awfully
restrictive, but it's not as bad as you think.  messages are of three
types, commands to be executed on a remote virtual machine, messages
that are to be handled by a machine as a service request or protocol
handshaking, and messages that are to be displayed on a virtual
machine's console (a terminal).  about 2/3 of the machines are IBM or
compatible hardware.  the majority of the non-IBM systems are VAXes
running either VMS or Unix (almost all 4.2bsd).  there are strange
systems on it such as CDC's and Burroughs too.

>BITNET is about 5 years old.  It is interconnected with some other networks
>which speak the same protocol, including VNET (IBM's internal network),
>EARN (the European version of BITNET), NetNorth (the Canadian version),
>and a version in the Pacific region (Asia, Australia, etc) is about to
>start up.  The connections with VNET are quite weak, but the other nets
>share the same name space and appear to the user as one network.

there are about 10 IBM sites on BITNET.  this is because only research
division personnel are allowed access to external networks.  VNET is
identical in structure to BITNET except that it is all IBM machines and
is about 1.5 times as large.  NETNORTH is connected to BITNET via
CANADA01, an IBM granted 4341.  EARN is connected to BITNET via EARNET,
an IBM Madrid site who pays for the trans-Atlantic link at no charge to
EARN.  the VNET gateway WATSON enforces the access rules for IBM people
reaching the outside world via BITNET.  isreal is connected through
ISREARN, another IBM research site that pays for the link between Madrid
and Tel Aviv.

>About a year ago, BITNET got a grant from IBM to improve things.  This
>grant went for a huge IBM mainframe (3081, I think) for the hub (CUNY)
>for support and development, plus a staff of a dozen or so people to
>do development, support, and administration.  I think the amount was
>originally around $2,000,000 (half for the mainframe) and it is expected
>to overrun to about $3,000,000.  It was to last two years, after which
>time BITNET becomes self-sufficient.  (Meanwhile, IBM is also funding
>the efforts in Europe, Canada, and Asia in similar and separate ways.)

i think you underestimate the cost of a 3081 (which is what CUNY has).
their configuration is closer to $1.5M just for the hardware.

>By the way, when I think of a new, wonderful network to replace what we
>have now, I think of something that replaces both UUCP and Usenet.  Both
>suffer from the same sorts of problems.  There could be considerable
>synergy from using one set of resources to solve both problems.

currently, USENET and UUCP are effectively one and the same in the eyes
of many people, and maybe they are.

>Possible sources of grants:  AT&T (to compete with IBM), Usenix, the federal
>government.  (If I stretch a bit I can picture DEC, HP, Tektronix, or Sun
>in this role, but these seem a bit less likely.)  Obviously IBM stuff costs
>a fortune, and we could do it for a lot less than $3M.

on the other hand, the 3081 could support 300 users comfortably.  and i
think your estimates are optimistic about the cost.  also i think the
US government would have a thing or two to say about e-mail reaching
outside the country.  not that i'm worried, i'm a canadian citizen.  i
can only be caught for spying.

<... about possible backbone nodes ...>
>These UNIX
>boxes would be dedicated gateways, so load on them doesn't matter.  They
>are sort of like ARPANET IMPs, but more powerful, programmable in C, able
>to use existing tools like TCP/IP and SLIP, but with 9600 baud links instead
>of 56K.  (We could upgrade individual links to 56K as needed later.)

you wouldn't want too small a box, or only one modem.  a backbone site
should ideally be always connected and able to converse simultaneously
with several other backbone sites on high speed communications lines
and locally with lower speed ones.  remember that a lot of the time a
box would have it's CPU idle while waiting for device interrupts.

>From Glenn C. Scott:
>  I don't want to sound like I want the future USENET to be based on UUCP or
>some other *old* technology.  But I do think that compatibility with many
>systems is important.  If we start using specialised hardware or expensive
>networks we might find USENET too expensive for other reasons than we have now.

compatibility to some degree must be maintained, but there must also be
some sacrifice to improve the total structure.  remember that the
backbones alone can use whatever they want to communicate between
themselves.  only the other sites calling in need older hardware and
software protocols.

>From Henry Spencer:
>One mistake we should avoid is the dreaded second-system effect:  trying
>to erect a beautiful edifice that will solve all the world's problems,
>and of course finding it necessary to employ all sorts of new and sexy
>but untried ideas.

for those of you who are familiar with OS/360, it was a second system
effort.  we must be VERY careful here not to exceed our means.

>Case in point...  It is fashionable to criticize the concept of "newsgroups".
>My contention is that the underlying concept -- a relatively modest number
>of well-defined categories which is *not* subject to extension at the whim
>of Joe Random User -- has served us well and should be kept in some form.
>Lauren's objections to keyword-based news systems seem cogent to me:  it is
>vital to have categories established by an authoritative mechanism rather
>than a quasi-random free-for-all, so that everyone agrees on the naming
>and organization of categories.

i belong to the IBM internal conferencing system.  it connects
everybody on VNET and is divided into about 40 large interest groups.
most of the ARPA mailing lists are deposited on the OTHERNET group, for
instance.  a lot of the purely technical USENET groups are also there.
don't be surprised, IBM has been in read-only mode on USENET for more
than a year.

each of these groups is maintained by a service virtual machine that
looks after updating files and history stuff for the administrators.
these groups are based in places all over the world and maintained at
the central site that created the group.  there can be from under a
hundred to more than a thousand FORUMs (or FORA if you prefer) going at
any one time on each disk.  anyone can create a new FORUM at any time.
because it is an internal network, it is self-policing.  all the FORUMs
are technical in nature although what is discussed is not neccesarily
IBM hardware or software.  you subscribe to a forum in one of two ways:
you get a message that tells you a FORUM was appended to and you look
then to see if it was interesting, or you have any changes to a FORUM
sent to you much as in a mailing list.  keeping track of everything
that goes on is very difficult, as you can imagine, with a total of
over 10,000 FORUMS in existence.  luckily, because they are technical
in nature and compartmentalized into about 40 broad groups, one can
eliminate some whole groups easily.  what constitutes a group?  Text
Processing, VM, MVS, Languages and Compilers, and so on.  given the
limitations of RSCS and the original lack of standard ways of sharing a
R/W filespace this is the technique that evolved.  it is a conference
system.  ALL postings are kept in one form or another online.  given
the typical configuration of an IBM internal system, it is not a great
burden to dedicate a 100M to 600M disk for a conference group.

>Third case in point:  dialup lines.  Simply because they can be justified
>for other, popular, purposes, it seems to me that dialup lines are likely
>to remain the primary communications medium for most sites, pious good
>wishes notwithstanding.         It's hard to be cheaper than "free", and the
>hardware we need for using phone lines tends to be effectively free because
>it is justified for other jobs.

dialup is probably with us for a long time for connections outside
the bacbone.  can some other method be used internally (so to speak).

Herbert A. Chong
H4-G58 Hawthorne
IBM Thomas J Watson Research Center
PO Box 218,
Yorktown Heights, NY 10598
Ph: (914) 789-7292

I'm still user-friendly -- I don't byte, I nybble....

VNET,BITNET,NETNORTH,EARN: HERBIE AT YKTVMH
UUCP:  {allegra|cbosgd|cmcl2|decvax|ihnp4|seismo}!philabs!polaris!herbie
CSNET: [email protected]
ARPA:  [email protected]
========================================================================
DISCLAIMER:  what you just read was produced by pouring lukewarm
tea for 42 seconds onto 9 people chained to 6 Ouiji boards.

From seismo!elsie!ado  Wed Nov 20 22:02:17 1985
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From: <seismo!elsie!ado>
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Date: Wed, 20 Nov 85 20:09:00 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: a short paragraph or two
Status: O
X-Status:
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> . . .someone suggested taht each member of the list post a short paragraph
> or two about themselves and why they are on the list.

I'm Arthur David Olson, a 1974 Computer Science graduate of the University of
California at San Diego's Revelle College.  My first UNIX experience was with
Version 6 running on an ersatz PDP-11/40 (a Cal Data XI).  I'm now working at
the National Insitutes of Health on a VAX 11/750 running 4.1BSD.

Back in the seventies, when Version 7 was released it wouldn't run on 11/40's--
so, for technical reasons, the site I worked at ran "backward" software.
Today, NIH and UCB lawyers have failed to create a mutually acceptable 4.2BSD
licensing agreement--so, for legal reasons, the site I work at runs backward
software.  The perspective I've gained from coping with these situations may be
of use in these discussions.

I'm on the list because I'm in a computing backwater.  I want to be able to
get help from other UNIX folks when strange problems show up at our site, and
Usenet gives a way to do that.  So out of sheer self interest I'm ready to do
some work to ensure the continued existence of the capabilities Usenet provides.

My feeling going in is that the biggest problems Usenet has aren't technical,
but rather personal and organizational ones.

                               --ado


From [email protected]  Sat Nov 23 21:08:07 1985
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Date: Sat, 23 Nov 85 20:47:25 est
From: Wombat <[email protected]>
Message-Id: <8511240147.AA08195@pucc-j>
To: usenet-II%[email protected]
Subject: my short paragraph or two
Cc: [email protected]
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Hiya.  I'm Rich Kulawiec, tho' most of you know me as Wombat.  I'm a
Unix systems programmer at Purdue's Computing Center, and I take care
of news on about 10 machines or so.  I'm one of three people at Purdue
who coordinate the local news feeds and all that stuff.  I'm also
working on a graduate degree in EE part-time; I'm interested in expert
systems, image processing, and ultrasonic tomography.  I've been
Unix-ified for about 5 years, and have worked on machines from 11/34's
running v6 to PurDual Vaxes running 4.3bsd.  I have no formal training
in CS, except for one freshman-level Fortran course--my degrees are in
Physics and EE.  I spend a fair amount of time immersed in Lisp and Prolog.

At this point in the discussion, I'm doing a lot of listening (sound of
jaws dropping coast-to-coast here); I'm going to re-read a lot of old
articles that I've saved, along with present and past correspondence,
before l chime in.  I will comment briefly on the environment that we
have here at PUCC and at Purdue in general.  PUCC has about 6500 Unix
users; the Engineering Computer Network (ECN) has about 12,000, and the
Computer Science department has around 400.  There are something like
30 Vaxes on campus, along with all sorts of 11's and Suns and so on.
The local internet is built on Ethernet, PROnet, and our PCL-11s, and
is tied together in places with DMR/C-11's.  There are also some other
machines around (CDC Cyber 205, IBM 3083, etc.) which are hung off at
various points around campus.  Most machines on campus suffer from a
lack of cycles, although sometimes disk space is a problem.  Network
bandwidth is not a problem.  Yet.  Lack of terminals would be a problem
if we had more cycles to go around.

We (PUCC) do not allow the vast majority of our users to post to the
net.* groups; only members of group "consult" or "staff" may do so.  We
did this to cut down on the noise that we generate, as our users are
mostly undergraduates, and tend to create large amounts of garbage.
(Incidentally, undergrad CS students use our machines, not CS's.) The
CS department has no restrictions, as the bulk of their users are grad
students, staff, and faculty.  ECN has no restrictions that I am aware
of.  We are considering (based on ECN's experience) removing our
restrictions, although we have no desire to be the source of much junk.
By the way, local newgroups are used to disseminate class assignments,
Mac user group notices, and the daily weather, among other things.

---Rsk

From masscomp!inmet!mirror!rs  Mon Nov 25 23:06:44 1985
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From: inmet!mirror!rs (Rich Salz)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: masscomp!gatech!usenet-II
Subject: Philosphy.
Status: O
X-Status:
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My name is Rich $alz, I am the SA at Mirror Systems where we have a
Vax750 running mtxinu-maintained 4.2, and a Pyramid 90x.  We have SysV
and BSD sources.  We run notes, version 1.7, modified by me to handle
moderated newsgroups and signature files.  We intend on putting some
other features in, and may eventually make a regular release of our
own.  I guess we're a leaf node; we call one system to get the news,
and one other system calls us in turn.

Any introduction to speechmaking says to start with a joke.  Very
well.  I think we should call the new system "D" news.  We've
already had "A" news, "B" news is what's out there now, and "C"
is likely to get confused with the language.  Besides, think how
much fun it would be to get our voice-synthesizers to prompt us
with, "and here now, D news."

I agree that Usenet is falling apart.  I'm yet convinced if the
rampant obnoxiousness, repetition, and such is a symptom or the
problem, but I am ready and willing to help correct the situation.
(I guess this is a good point to say that I'm really flattered
to be part of this group, having really only been part of the
net for less than a year.)

I agree that the most important point is to define what the next
usenet should be like:  what are its goals.  I haven't seen much
on this yet, so let me throw out a few ideas.  I don't necessarily
agree with all of them, but want to get the discussion rolling
before we decide what features the new net should have.
       1.  It should be limited-access net; you can't just
           join by finding a friendly neighbor.  There's
           real membership duties and dues and probationary
           periods -- both for sites and for users.
       2.  There should be at least site registration, perhaps
           user registration.
       3.  There should be a formal group responsible for
           enforcing "the rules."
       4.  Not everyone in the net gets to vote on policy;
           perhaps just SA's.

I don't know what to suggest for discussion areas/limitations.  I read
a fair number of technical groups (wizards, mod.std.unix, *.sources*,
net.text, laser-lovers, et. al.), and a few non-technical groups.  Of
the latter, net.games.* stand out because their traffic is so low that
I can afford the time to read them all, net.comics has the highest S/N
ratio of anything around, and I used to read net.music until Doug Allen
(nessus@mit-eddie) drove me away.  I can't come up with a consistant
viewpoint that encompasses all these areas, so I won't try.

Finally, I think DON'T think we should call the "rules" document a
constitution as that sounds a bit too pretentious.  RFC fits in nicely
with the technical frame of mind around here, and RFC's, like study
groups, can have "charges" (or preambles).  Since we really will be
dealing with philosophy, though, maybe we can call it a charter.
       5.  Discussions should be mainly technical, concentrating
           in areas of interest to Unix people.  2.  It should support
       the Amish punishment of "banning"
           where nobody talks to the guilty party.  3.  There should
       be an elected Board responsible

From akgua!packard!ihnp4!uiucdcs!ccvaxa!preece  Mon Nov 25 23:11:11 1985
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Date: 25 Nov 1985 14:09-CST
From: packard!ihnp4!uiucdcs!ccvaxa!preece (Scott E. Preece)
Subject: Introductory random thoughts
Message-Id: <501797379/preece@fang>
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To: ihnp4!seismo!gatech!usenet-II
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Status: O
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I've been a Usenet participant for about four years.  Before that
I participated in similar networks on Plato and elsewhere.
I was our UUCP and notesfile administrator for about a year;
that's no longer my job, but I still work on the notes software
off and on to support our particular needs.  I would
like to see Usenet evolve (actually, I guess it's not evolution
but revolution, but I can't say "I want to see Usenet revolve"...)
into a service or family of services that provides all the kinds of
access that Usenet does, but functions more reliably, efficiently,
and quickly.

I think there should be both intelligently, selectively edited
digests and network-wide unmoderated channels.  I think there
should be "official" channels for specific vendors to speak
and be spoken to through. I think there should be an underlying
transport mechanism that provides high bandwidth at low cost and
is paid for by all the members equitably at a rate low enough to
allow all our members to come out of their corporate closets and
get their companies' blessings.  I think there should be a
well-defined performance goal for the network as a whole, which
could be used to guide policy in selecting and monitoring
topology (for instance, "mean time for passage between any two
sites shall be less than 48 hours").  I think the transport
mechanism should be clearly separated from the user interface
so that news successors and notes successors can coexist happily.
I think it should be easy to create a new group and that it should
be completely acceptable to have multiple overlapping groups with
different personalities.  I think there should be a good mechanism
for supporting one or more distribution centers for a group, so that
a site would not have to take everything unless it (or its downstream
feeds) wanted everything: it should be easy for a reader somewhere to
see a description and say "Send me a sample of group x" and later
to ask for a regular subscription or even the existing archives.
I think it should be possible to refer to previous items and to
annotate them with added comments.

Basic net services seem to fall into several areas:
       Distribution (one to many) channels like net.sources
       Magazine (one to many plus response) channels like mod.whatever
       Discussion (many to many) channels like net.whatever
       Appeal (one to many with personal response) channels
               like net.wanted
       Mail (one to one) channels like mail
Each class has different requirements for effective utilization,
possibly modified by subject area and readership.  Mail should be
delivered very quickly; net.sources could be delivered weekly
with no loss of value.  Some discussions are very volatile and
suffer with any delay; some discussions call for detailed, reasoned
submissions and gain little from high connectivity.  Subdomains are
clearly useful, too.

I expect to have a more detailed description of the net as I'd like
to see it in a while; right now I'm still mulling the question.


From masscomp!inmet!mirror!rs  Tue Nov 26 05:02:03 1985
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From: inmet!mirror!rs (Rich Salz)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: masscomp!gatech!usenet-II
Subject: Necessary features
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 14


In this message I'd like to mention, despite my previous note, some
technical features I think the new usenet should have.

The naming system should be clean and consistant.  For example, net.*
basically implies world-wide distribution, yet eur.* is a top-level
name that really belongs in net.  Perhaps we should take distribution
out of the discussion group name.  Instead, distribution should be on a
per-message feature.

It should be possible to get a "policy" or "description" of each
discussion group.  This is issued from a central authority and is
the same on all systems, with perhaps local (automatic) additions
giving the default distribution and access.

Read and write access should be on a finer grain than all or
nothing.  It should at least be doable on a per-discussion basis.
But should it be based on inclusion or exclusion?  I don't know.

It would be a real win if, by registerng each site (and user?)
someone could read an article and then query a database to find
out who the author is.  A newnet-wide "finger" service.

Moderation or editing, if not intrinsic to the newnet, should be
supported from the ground up.

There should be monitoring at the site-level of both reading and
writing.  If, e.g., we keep all ".newsrc2" files in one spot, then this
can be much easier.  As a minimum, the SA should be able to get a log
of all messages written at his/her site, sorted by any of distribution,
date, size, author, newsgroup.  Similarly, s/he should be able to get a
"time of last access" listing for each newsgroup, for anyone who has
ever read the newsgroup.

One the one hand, I like the idea of being able to interface the net
into the user's mail reader easily.  Like the telephone:  whether it's
a one-on-one call, or a conference call, the basic mechanisms are the
same.  On the other hand, if we decide to impose some sort of structure
on the communication (articles/followups or basenote/responses), then
none of the current Unix(tm) mailers really fit.  Of course, we could
always expand our scope to include writing a mailer....  (I'll comment
more on this after I've read the "Dragonmail" paper.)

The system should be screen-oriented.  I'm not exactly sure what this
means, other than it should use termcap/curses/terminfo.  Basically,
there should always be useful information on the screen.  Unlike mail,
I shouldn't have to explicitly say "show me the first message."  Most
commands should be a single letter; if they all fit under one hand,
even better.

From [email protected]  Tue Nov 26 12:17:01 1985
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Date: Tue, 26 Nov 85 12:06:16 est
From: <[email protected]>
Posted-Date: Tue, 26 Nov 85 12:06:16 est
Received-Date: Tue, 26 Nov 85 12:06:16 est
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: msdc!gatech!usenet-II
Subject: my intro
Status: O
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X-UID: 15

My name is Dan Forsyth.  I was introduced to Unix as an undergrad at
Georgia Tech around ten years ago.  After spending several years trying
to make a roomful of Primes as useful as a PDP11, I came to work here
in the "real world" producing Unix-based large-scale clinical
information systems about four years ago.  We've been on Usenet since
the "A" news days; I think it's been about three and a half years.

Glenn's comments started me thinking about how Usenet came into being,
at least in this isolated part of the world.

Back "in the good old days", there were Unix machines that sat idle
most of the night when their playmates went home, and they had phone
lines and modems that sat idle while their programmers were snug in
their beds.  And all of a sudden the poor isolated technocrats that ran
them heard a wonderful suggestion from a Usenix conference.  (This was
in the days when our customers didn't just ask "What's a Unix?", they
asked "What's a DEC?  Do they make IBM computers, too?")  For the mere
cost of a few late-night long-distance calls to some other isolated
technocracy in North Carolina, we could have technical contact with all
the other serious Unix developers out there in the world.  Such a
deal!  (Turns out we had to invest in a newly-announced Hayes
Smartmodem to do our dialing.  Extracting that $249 was a monumental
achievement in salesmanship.  It certainly took more than $249 in lost
time.)

We received most of the news at 300 baud until Hayes released the
Smartmodem 1200.  We didn't get all of the groups, but we did get a
good proportion of them.  Our phone bills were running in the low
hundreds of dollars a month.  By that time, though, we had gotten quite
a bit of valuable information from the net (especially from
unix-wizards and bugs), and fortunately we could show that it had saved
us thousands of dollars of time and money.  Thus it was relatively easy
to prove that the phone bills were worth it, especially since we could
now buy a 1200 baud modem and cut the costs by at least two-thirds.  At
that time, we were supplying the newsgroups that we got from ncsu and
mcnc to a few local sites, gatech being one of them.  Somewhere along
the road, Lindsay Cleveland at akgua began to bring in all the news
groups and very generously offered them to us and gatech and the rest
of Atlanta.  Since we were constrained to running news on an Onyx at
the time, we were only too glad to have someone take over; 20MB of disk
only went so far in the days before batching.

I'm offering this chronical to illustrate a couple of points.  Number
one is that without getting a foot in the door we never would have
gotten the several hundred dollars a month (our actual costs) we would
have needed to subscribe to such a service up front.  The fact that we
had the cpu cycles and equipment lying around allowed us to get in with
a minimal up-front investment.  Number two is the old "it's easier to
ask forgiveness that to ask for permission".  If we had stated up front
that we would be requiring $300/month for phone bills, I seriously
doubt that we could have extracted permission even for a test period.
As it was, it sounded innocent enough at first, and we had hard
justification by the time questions were asked.

Times have changed a lot since then.  We have the personal computer
node issues.  There is the RBBS craze.  There are commercial services
that provide similar forums to Usenet (for a price).  There is
Stargate.  We have a lot more sites with enlightened management (e.g.
if you said Usenet was going to cost us a $3000 a year subscription, I
figure I'd have about a 70% chance of getting the bucks for it.  That's
up from 0% four years ago).  Computers, and modems, and autodialers are
cheap; phone lines and phone calls are more expensive.  We also have a
few incredibly generous (intentionally or unintentionally)
organizations that spend huge amounts of money on Usenet to support
effective freeloaders like us.

But I think the fundamental foot-in-the-door/permission problem still
remains.  And I see it as the first question that we have to address:
do we want to potentially exclude the technical staffs at installations
that have unenlightened management.  If we don't want to exclude them,
we have to use an organization and technology that can support
"freeloaders" for a low front end cost.  That either means they have to
pay in phone charges or cpu time, at least at the beginning.  (This
also brings up the question of public institutions providing "free"
service to a commercial network "company" that charges other people for
their work.  At least an anarchy doesn't have this problem.)  We must
also require that the new system be supportable on dial-up phone lines
with unmodified (binary license) uucps, since that's all a lot of folks
have.

My thinking on this subject tells me that a system that (at least
superficially) looks like the current Usenet with more political clout
(and better software and hardware technology) is still the way to go in
providing the widest range of access.  (Something on the order of "If
we allow you to join this network, you agree to abide by the rulings
set down by the paying-membership-elected 'board of directors'; if you
misbehave, you get chopped off.")

I've purposely begged the question of whether supporting "freeloading"
with unenlightened management is a "good thing."  I'd like to hear the
group consensus regarding what kind of an audience is desirable.  What
sacrifices should organizations have to make to join Usenet-II?  Do we
want "just anybody" to be able to buy a PC and hook up?  Do we want to
explicitly limit membership?  Do we want to implicitly limit membership
by requiring large amounts of committed resources, (like BITNET or
ARPANET)?

We need to make these choices up front, because the answers to these
questions are going to define our technological constraints.  (Even
though my outlook is somewhat myopic, I suspect we can get the
necessary resources to join whatever the reformed net might be.  So I
don't really have a vested interest in which way it goes.)

Dan Forsyth             ({gatech,akgua,mcnc}!msdc!dan)
Medical Systems Development Corporation, Atlanta, GA

P.S.  I think we could save the current Usenet if we psycho-probed all
users to determine whether they think use of the net is a "right" or
a "privilege"; then we just disconnect all the "rights".  Any takers?


From seismo!harvard!wjh12!mirror!rs  Wed Nov 27 10:01:29 1985
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From: seismo!harvard!wjh12!mirror!rs (Rich Salz)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected], [email protected]
Subject: Re:  Philosophy
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 16


Oh my gosh, I'm so embarrased. ;-)
Please delete the last two lines from my first message;
the ones that started "5.  Discussions should be mainly..."
Ooops.

From hplabs!glacier!reid  Wed Nov 27 11:43:04 1985
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Date: 26 Nov 1985 1522-PST (Tuesday)
From: Brian Reid <hplabs!glacier!reid>
To: hplabs!gatech!usenet-II
Cc: reid
Subject: intro
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 17

I'm Brian Reid. I'm a professor of computer science and electrical
engineering at Stanford. I've been a diehard, addicted user of
electronic communication since 1967. I'm the netnews administrator for
glacier, a minor backbone site, and for Stanford, a university that
basically couldn't care if Usenet lives or dies [most people here
consider it garbage, and stick to ARPAnet]. We have about 100 Unix
systems here on campus (mostly VAXes), and only 6 of them run netnews.
2 of those 6 are talking about canceling.

I come to this group not from a love of Usenet but from a love of
electronic communication. I am willing to take absolutely nothing for
granted in the creation of "Usenet II". Newsgroups vs. keywords? News
or notes or something new? Hierarchical naming or identifier naming?
Mail transport or custom protocol transport? Any and all of these
things are candidates for rework or replacement. Moderators? Cross
postings? Binaries? Censorship? Control? Robustness? Flaming? Hey,
these are very real issues.

I'm slightly cynical about Usenet II, but I'm willing to work on it. I
don't believe it will ever amount to much unless it is radically
restructured (incremental change won't help much).

Here's a potpourri of suggestions for radical changes.
  * All netwide groups moderated
  * All unmoderated groups topologically local (i.e. no per-message
    toll connections in unmoderated groups)
  * Consistent statistics of READERSHIP, not writership, made
    available.
  * Capability for multiple and distributed moderators (i.e.
    software support for this--you can do it now but it is hard).
  * Official software support for the concept that not all sites, even
    backbone sites, get all groups. Perhaps backbone sites will relay a
    group without storing it (as we do with net.religion and
    net.origins and net.politics now).

These are design desiderata. What do I want? This:
  * I want the psychological reward to a poster to be derived from the
    number of people who READ his message, and not from the number of
    bytes in it. This will encourage quality postings.
  * I want to create a situation something like current magazine
    publishing, where there is prestige attached to having your stuff
    accepted by certain moderators, so that people are willing to hold
    the good stuff for the quality places.
  * I want to minimize the delay of moderation.

My time is worth money to me, and I could easily raise thousands of
dollars per year of Stanford money to pay towards the salary of
professional moderators. I'm sure other places could too. I think that
this stands in stark contrast to the sites that have trouble raising
$250 for a modem, and I think it is important that we have both kinds
of people involved in the redesign.

I think that a network of the kind that I want could be built using the
transport mechanism of the current network, by having paid professional
moderators who read through all of the swill and produced digests that
they sent to me to read. Actually, they could just send me message
numbers and my software would find the messages.

More thoughts on how to achieve these things in a later message.

From spaf  Wed Nov 27 13:27:09 1985
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       id AA05451; Wed, 27 Nov 85 13:27:09 EST
Date: Wed, 27 Nov 85 13:27:09 EST
From: Gene Spafford <spaf>
Posted-Date: Wed, 27 Nov 85 13:27:09 EST
Received-Date: Wed, 27 Nov 85 13:27:09 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: usenet-ii
Subject: Administrivia
Cc: mark, [email protected]
Status: O
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Some of you have recently submitted items to the list and gotten
back some (possibly cryptic) error messages from uf-csv and uf-cgrl.
Our mailer here was attempting to route some mail from the list
through uf-cgrl to uw-beaver, and evidently the mailer at uf-cgrl
is broken in a big way.

I've removed uf-cgrl from our routing tables until I receive evidence
that the problem has been fixed.  If you got one of these error messages,
you can ignore it.  If you haven't received any of the last few
messages:
       "my intro"      dan@msdc
       "Re:  Philosophy"       mirror!rs
       "intro"         glacier!reid
then let me know and I will provide duplicates from the archives.
My records show 17 messages so far.

I'm still not quite caught up on all the mail that piled up while I
was away, and my thesis is receiving the first 110% of my attention, so
if you are expecting mail from me, don't fret too much yet.  Really
important mail should have something like URGENT in the subject
to catch my attention.....

--gene

From seismo!vortex!lauren  Fri Nov 29 02:40:43 1985
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Date: Thu, 28-Nov-85 21:29:25 PST
From: seismo!vortex!lauren (Lauren Weinstein)
Subject: misc.
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: vortex!gatech!usenet-II
Status: O
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Frankly, I have grave doubts that the sorts of models being batted
around for "Usenet-II" (I don't like this name, by the way) are
really going to do us much good in the long run.  Or possibly even
in the short run.

First a given: ANY successful information "service" must be largely
or completely based on moderated "groups" of some sort.  The level
of "moderation" required may vary from topic to topic, of course.
Hopefully we all agree on these fundamental points, so I'm not going
to wave the moderation banner here--I've done so plenty of times in
detail in the past.  If I need to clarify what I mean by
"moderation," please let me know--different levels of
moderation DO exist.

But there is more required than moderation for an information system to
operate successfully and SCALE UPWARD well.

Dialup systems (the choice of transport protocols is virtually
irrelevant to this discussion) may SEEM to sometimes be "cheap"
but really aren't.  The costs are real, especially in an era when paying
per minute for even LOCAL phone calls will be the norm in a few years for
both businesses and residential users.  But even worse, dialup systems,
as we've seen the hard way with Usenet, can suffer badly when we're
dealing with large numbers of sites and large amounts of data.  I won't
detail the problems here unless someone really wants me to--I assume
we're all familiar with the problems of coordinating and operating
such systems once they get beyond a small scale.  They just don't
scale upward well.

For mail, dialup systems tend to sometimes be a comparatively economical
choice since we're usually dealing with only one or a very limited number
of recipients.  The uucp network really does work very well for mail.
But for items (like netnews) that we really want to send to as many
people as possible as quickly as possible, dialup systems introduce
too many problems.  Costs, coordination, data volumes, time-lags, etc.
are all major problems with dialup systems in netnews type operations.
The issue of time-lags is critical for systems that plan to operate
on a moderated basis, since the moderation process itself by definition
introduces lag above and beyond that already inherent in the distribution
system.  The time-lag inherent in dialup systems, combined with moderation,
make a bad problem even worse.

Some people point at packet networks as a help... but in reality they
are just another form of dialup system in terms of their operational
characteristics.  For simple cases, you still have to dialup the
network nodes, deal with the networks' usually lousy throughput and other
undesirable characteristics, and face the spectre of sudden fee/rate
changes, sudden influxes of other network users that degrade
network performance or tie up non-leased line access ports, etc.
The access port problem can be helped by using (usually higher speed)
leased connections, but these entail significant costs, telco
hassles, and other problems, and STILL don't help with the overall
network throughput and other problems associated with having to
ship materials to lots of distributed sites on a one-at-a-time basis.

In any case, it's clear that the same time-lag and coordination
problems occur with these packet networks as with more "conventional"
dialup systems.

Another range of issues revolves around centralized vs. distributed
systems--this also relates to the time-lag problem.  Many of Usenet's
problems have been heavily related to something we often consider
to be a positive attribute--its distributed nature.  This distributed
characteristic has led inevitably to time-lags and coordination problems,
for a variety of reasons which I can discuss if people so desire.
Most of the somewhat "successful" discussion systems in use
now are highly centralized, rather than distributed (they're also usually
moderated to some degree, and are always "watched over" to avoid
distribution of illegal or "nonsense" materials).  Models of these
are the systems like Compuserve and the like.  But these systems have
major problems as well.  The volume of calls hitting these systems
have crippled not only the serving computers, but also the data networks
and even the phone networks processing the calls.  Service to other
customers (data and phone) have obviously suffered as a result.  So
centralized systems have lots of problems as well.

So, I've now condemned both distributed and centralized systems.
I've condemned both dialup and packet switched distribution
systems.  Gee whiz, Lauren, what's left?  Ah hah!  You know
where I'm going!  Up, up and away, into deep space of course!

I feel very strongly that the solution is to make the best possible
use of something that is still available to us and that has actually
been moving along very well (though I haven't been talking about
it publicly very much, for the same sorts of reasons that this
mailing list is not a newsgroup!)  I'm referring to Stargate of course.

Stargate still spins.  In fact it spins very well, indeed.  The reasons
you haven't heard too much lately are twofold... One, there are various
negotiations going on regarding funding, organization, operations, etc.
that by their very nature can't go on with too much wide public fanfare.
Two, there have been some technical holds while mass production of
decoders, and uplink software to handle those decoders, was being
developed and installed by the carrier.  I'm pleased to be able to
say that the decoders are now becoming available--I hope to have a few
of the new ones within the next month or two and switch the test
data feed from the old decoders to the new ones.  Other good news:
a prototype "buffer box" (which will be quite inexpensive) is
being built as I speak, and will apparently be offered to Stargate
at cost.  (The buffer box takes the output from the Stargate decoder,
stores and processes articles (error correction, etc.), feeds them
to the local "mainframe" computer, and performs various other
useful tasks.)

On the non-technical side, project funding sources are still
being solicited, and perhaps some of the persons/companies
involved in this list would like to participate in helping
in this aspect of the project!  Also, I may shortly be able
to offer a number of new decoders to a number of sites for testing.
I have been contacted by /usr/group in regards to helping to fund
part of Stargate.  There is hope that Stargate will help to
create a joint forum in which Usenix (which has funded the
experiment up to now), /usr/group, and other organizations can
all work together to bring to pass the "alternative" information
service that I've proposed Stargate should be.

Remember, it has been my intention that Stargate, as an operational
service, would be an alternative to Usenet.  Some of the same
topics might be discussed, and there might even be some very carefully
controlled crossflow with Usenet.  But in general Stargate would
be a separate information service, with moderation (to one extent
or another, depending on user desires and other requirements) being
the standard mode of operation.  Stargate's big advantage over all
other means of distributing material is obvious, of course.
It can distribute material to an essentially unlimited number of
points (by cable TV or cheapo satellite dish) simultanteously, and
on a 24 hour/day basis.  A continuous data stream to carry
whatever information we see fit, hitting almost everywhere that
satellite Superstation WTBS can reach.  Facilities would need to be
made available for sites who could not receive satellite WTBS to receive
appropriate materials by other means, but by and large it's
becoming obvious that the number of points that can receive WTBS
(through one technique or another) is very large and will become
even larger over the near future.  And that's the key--Stargate is
BROADCASTING of material--which avoids the time-lag, dialup and
packet network saturation, coordination, and many other problems inherent
in systems other than Stargate.

The satellite uplink people are still very enthusiastic about Stargate,
and are still willing to make a TERRIFIC deal when it comes to
satellite bandwidth.  I've said it before, and I'll say it again:
It is unlikely that we'll ever have a comparable opportunity.
The installation I made at the WTBS uplink has been running on WTBS
for almost a year now, and it's time to start moving toward broader
testing and onward toward a real service.  The uplink folks think that
the sort of plans I've outlined for an information service will work well,
and they are serious about helping Stargate.

I would like to solicit your help in making such a service a
reality.  Now's the time for me to go back to the satellite
people, and to the organizations who have offered support of the
project, and say, "Look at all these additional people and companies
who want to participate!  Look what we can accomplish!"
Everything is set for a gigantic leap forward--but I need your
help to make it happen.  I'll need some test sites quite soon,
but I need help with organizational issues involving the operational
aspects of such a service, moderation and moderators (choice of
moderators, control of moderators, moderation levels and
guidelines, etc.)  Technical issues involving software on the
receiving sites and at the uplink, the best way to handle delivery
of materials from users to moderators and from moderators to the
Stargate uplink, and a wide variety of other topics, including funding,
payments to moderators, organizational issues of all sorts, etc.,
all need to be discussed.  I can't carry on such a discussion in
the wide public forum of net.news.stargate.

I want Stargate to be that "alternative" of which I've spoken
many times.  A high quality alternative to Usenet that could
benefit a very large number of people and could grow without
running into the sorts of technical and cost limitations that
cause problems for other technologies when they attempt to
scale up.  I'd like Stargate to be able to grow and expand
without running into such problems, and I think it can.
But I can't proceed entirely by myself any longer.  I need your input,
and I'm hoping that this forum can work with me toward making
this a reality.  I hope you'll be willing to help shape Stargate
into something that will be of benefit to a large and
rapidly growing community, something we can all be proud of.

Care to participate?  Please let me know.  Thanks.

--Lauren--


From cbosgd!cbpavo.cbosgd.ATT.UUCP!mark  Sat Dec  7 20:17:31 1985
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Date: Sat, 7 Dec 85 18:16:30 est
From: [email protected] (Mark Horton)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: questionnaire
Status: O
X-Status:
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X-UID: 20

[This is a remailing - apologies in advance if you get two copies.]

I'd appreciate it if each of you would take a couple minutes and
fill this out.  It will help me get a feel for some of the gut
reactions to some of the issues that people have.  After you fill
it out, please feel free to discuss things on the list, and then
perhaps if we don't have a concensus we can do another poll.

Thanks,

       Mark

This questionnaire is to help determine the primary structure of the
organization to be formed.

For each of these questions, please give an indication of your thoughts.
Some possible responses are included, but feel free to make up your own.
More than one answer is possible, you can edit this message and delete
the answers that do not apply.  None of these constitute a committment
to you or your organization, this is just to get ideas about the direction
to proceed.

(1) What direction would you like to see the successor to Usenet go?
   (a) No change - just keep the existing net.
   (b) Form a formal organization (e.g. elected positions) of volunteers.
       There would be no funding and no money for expenses.
   (c) Form a non-profit corporation which has funding from members
       and a few salaried employees.
   (d) Form a for-profit business intended to make money.
   (e) Join up with CSNET and use their structure and organization.

(2) What resources do you think your organization could provide?
   (a) People to help administer the net (e.g. moderators, consultants)
   (b) People to write and support software.
   (c) Significant telephone calls (e.g. you call other sites with UUCP.)
   (d) Use of other long-haul data networks (e.g. X.25, ARPA-like.)
   (e) Money for equipment (e.g. modems, gateways) and leased lines.
   (f) Money for membership dues in the organization.
   (g) Possible source of a grant to get the organization started.

(3) What activity would you like to do with the new network?
   (a) None, I'm an interested bystander.
   (b) Administrative (troubleshooting, helping new sites, planning, etc.)
   (c) Technical (software development, support, etc.)
   (d) Editorial (e.g. moderator, reader of other sources of postings.)

(4) What sort of involvement with this new network would you personally like?
   (a) None, I'm an interested bystander.
   (b) Volunteer, putting in perhaps 1-5 hours/week
   (c) Part time paid.
   (d) Full time paid, but remaining in my current home.
   (e) Full time paid, willing to relocate to the headquarters.

(5) To what extent do you think the new newsgroups (or whatever get created)
   should be moderated?
   (a) No moderation whatsoever.
   (b) Moderation only for a few key newsgroups, as in the current situation.
   (c) Moderation of perhaps half the groups
   (d) Moderation as the default, with a few unmoderated groups.
   (e) Moderation of everything.

(6) How do you feel about etiquette on the new network?  (I'm talking about
   public postings ala netnews, rather than private mail.)
   (a) Ignore the issue, let people flame if they wish.
   (b) Have articles like net.announce.newusers to educate people.
   (c) Have a "Network Drivers License" that people must qualify
       for before they can post.
   (d) Like c but the license can be revoked after some formal process.
   (e) Like d but even stricter: copy the Japanese style of always being
       very polite and respectful of other people and very humble about
       yourself.  Repeated bad manners in public are grounds for revocation.

From research!icarus!jj  Sat Dec  7 23:37:31 1985
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From: <research!icarus!jj>
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the questionaire from Mark, etc.

I havent' said much to date, because I'm NOT a site admin, I'm nostly
a participant, and I have no "real" net power. (other than argument)

I liked most of Mark's questionaire, but I did find a few points that
I felt were not carefully designed in the questionaire.

In particular,  I think any new attempt at a net should be
1)  Set up so that if necessary, disciplinary measures CAN be
taken BY the net.
2)  I think that initially, participants should be allowed the
priveledge of posting, and that the assumption should be
innocent until proven guilty, not the other way around, as Mark's
questionaire seems to presume, i.e. the "net driver's liscense"
idea.  Clearly, any first time poster should read an etiquette
document, stating quite clearly that "flaming", personal attacks,
AA violations, etc, are VERBOTEN before they post, but I think
that such can be done via simple software, i.e. keep a list
on the machine and put up the etiquette document for those
who haven't posted in n weeks, or what-have-you.  (When you
post.)

3)  New sites should understand that their admission is predicated
on good behavior, old sites likewise.  I.E.  a failure to self-police
can lead to disconnection.



I don't have any feel for the business end of making a new net
arrangement work, so I will not speculate.


A comment about the current state of nutnoise:
       The point that flaming is NOT ACCEPTED hasn't been made.
The semi-deletion of nut.flame has NOT convinced people, partially
because it was only a semi-deletion.  ihnp4, in particular
is holding net.flame together for a lot of us, and the newsgroup  is
starting to reconstruct itself as people realize that it still
gets around.  While this is somewhat supply/demand showing up,
there has to be a strong point that flaming is NOT acceptable
anywhere to a great proportion of the backbone.  That point
is very hard to realize right now.


JJ

From ulysses!burl!rcj  Sun Dec  8 14:46:15 1985
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From: <ulysses!burl!rcj>
Posted-Date: Sun, 8 Dec 85 14:25:11 est
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Date: Sun, 8 Dec 85 14:25:11 est
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To: ulysses!gatech!usenet-II
Subject: Re:  questionnaire
Status: O
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       (1) What direction would you like to see the successor to Usenet go?
           (b) Form a formal organization (e.g. elected positions) of
               volunteers.  There would be no funding and no money for
               expenses.

       (2) What resources do you think your organization could provide?
           (b) People (probably 2 on a very parttime basis) to write and
               support software.
           (c) Significant telephone calls (e.g. you call other sites with
               UUCP.) -- only other AT&T sites, unfortunately.

       (3) What activity would you like to do with the new network?
           (c) Technical (software development, support, etc.)

       (4) What sort of involvement with this new network would you personally
           like?
           (b) Volunteer, putting in perhaps 1-5 hours/week
           (c) Part time paid. -- (would be nice but doesn't jive with my
               answer to (1))

       (5) To what extent do you think the new newsgroups (or whatever get
           created) should be moderated?
           (c) Moderation of perhaps half the groups

       (6) How do you feel about etiquette on the new network?  (I'm talking
           about public postings ala netnews, rather than private mail.)
           (b) Have articles like net.announce.newusers to educate people.
           (c) Have a "Network Drivers License" that people must qualify
               for before they can post.
           (d) Like c but the license can be revoked after some formal
               process.
           UNFORTUNATELY, (c) and (d) would be completely unenforcable;
           even given extensive software support most users have several
           logins to use -- and we can't count on local support to stop
           postaholics either -- look at Rich Rosen.  The only way to make
           this enforcable is to (a) support it in software, and (b) make
           it the responsibility of the site admin to make sure his/her people
           stay in line -- if they don't then cut off the site itself.
           I find that both unrealistic and detrimental to what I consider
           the spirit of the net, but if it is a choice of losing the net
           (Usenet I or II), I'd even support the site-responsibility idea.

The MAD Programmer -- 919-228-3313 (Cornet 291)
alias: Curtis Jackson   ...![ ihnp4 ulysses cbosgd mgnetp ]!burl!rcj
                       ...![ ihnp4 cbosgd akgua masscomp ]!clyde!rcj



From seismo!polaris!herbie  Thu Dec 12 01:45:00 1985
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From: <seismo!polaris!herbie>
Posted-Date: 11-Dec-1985 21:10-EST (Wednesday)
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Date: 11-Dec-1985 21:10-EST (Wednesday)
To: [email protected]
Subject: stargate
Status: O
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well, no-one has said anything for a while, so here goes.

Lauren and others have mentioned both here and in net.news.group
that stargate is a valid alternative for broadcasting news.
it is inherently a good medium for that.  my concerns with using
stargate are:

1)      how do you get news to the earthstation that talks on the
       uplink to the satellite?  or do you have everyone that's a
       backbone site buy a transmitter and use a collision detection
       protocol up there?  this only works if no-one else is using the
       satellite for anything.  if you don't have a special way for
       the backbones getting to the earthstation this idea leaves you
       at square one, propogating news along via best possible means
       until it reaches stargate.

2)      who pays for the hardware?  it is a capital expenditure
       that is larger than most monthly phone bills, but smaller than
       a new CPU.  selling the idea to management may be more
       difficult than asking them to buy higher speed dedicated modems
       because the latter is an 'upgrade' rather than a change in
       technology.

if this has been discussed before in net.news.stargate i missed
it because i unsubscribed about 3 weeks after it was created.

Herb Chong...

I'm still user-friendly -- I don't byte, I nybble....

VNET,BITNET,NETNORTH,EARN: HERBIE AT YKTVMH
UUCP:  {allegra|cbosgd|cmcl2|decvax|ihnp4|seismo}!philabs!polaris!herbie
CSNET: [email protected]
ARPA:  [email protected]
========================================================================
DISCLAIMER:  what you just read was produced by pouring lukewarm
tea for 42 seconds onto 9 people chained to 6 Ouiji boards.

From ulysses!burl!rcj  Thu Dec 12 11:27:19 1985
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From: <ulysses!burl!rcj>
Posted-Date: Thu, 12 Dec 85 10:45:22 est
Received-Date: Thu, 12 Dec 85 11:15:36 EST
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Date: Thu, 12 Dec 85 10:45:22 est
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To: ulysses!gatech!usenet-II
Subject: Re:  stargate
Status: O
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If handled properly from a "wouldn't this be great PR" angle, the capital
expenditure for the Stargate hardware could probably be squeezed out of
management rather quickly.

"<Generic Company Inc.> today announced that it will be joining in a world-
wide satellite-based computer news network designed to provide rapid
dissemination of pertinent issues to companies and universities world-wide.
The network, called Stargate, will...."

I know the above is cheesy, but you get the idea.

The MAD Programmer -- 919-228-3313 (Cornet 291)
alias: Curtis Jackson   ...![ ihnp4 ulysses cbosgd mgnetp ]!burl!rcj
                       ...![ ihnp4 cbosgd akgua masscomp ]!clyde!rcj



From clyde!watmath!rjwhite  Fri Dec 13 06:26:18 1985
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From: RJ White <clyde!watmath!rjwhite>
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: clyde!cbpavo.cbosgd.ATT!gatech!mark,
       clyde!cbpavo.cbosgd:att!gatech!usenet-II
Subject: Re:  questionnaire
Status: RO
X-Status:
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(1) What direction would you like to see the successor to Usenet go?
   (b) Form a formal organization (e.g. elected positions) of volunteers.
       There would be no funding and no money for expenses.
   (c) Form a non-profit corporation which has funding from members
       and a few salaried employees.
   (d) Form a for-profit business intended to make money.
   (e) Join up with CSNET and use their structure and organization.

       ie : DONT keep the existing net

(2) What resources do you think your organization could provide?
   (c) Significant telephone calls (e.g. you call other sites with UUCP.)
   (d) Use of other long-haul data networks (e.g. X.25, ARPA-like.)

(3) What activity would you like to do with the new network?
   (b) Administrative (troubleshooting, helping new sites, planning, etc.)

       (b') Local Administration.

(4) What sort of involvement with this new network would you personally like?
   (a) None, I'm an interested bystander.

       ( with 17 VAX's to support, I have little time for news )

(5) To what extent do you think the new newsgroups (or whatever get created)
   should be moderated?
   (c) Moderation of perhaps half the groups
   (d) Moderation as the default, with a few unmoderated groups.
   (e) Moderation of everything.

       ie : MORE moderation

(6) How do you feel about etiquette on the new network?  (I'm talking about
   public postings ala netnews, rather than private mail.)
   (b) Have articles like net.announce.newusers to educate people.

       (c') software to easily prevent specified users from posting.
       I dont think that (c), (e) or (f) would work (Network Drivers licence)

From seismo!vortex!lauren  Fri Dec 13 20:11:25 1985
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Date: Thu, 12-Dec-85 19:02:49 PST
From: seismo!vortex!lauren (Lauren Weinstein)
Subject: Re: stargate
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: vortex!gatech!seismo!polaris!herbie
Cc: vortex!gatech!usenet-II
In-Reply-To: Your message of 11-Dec-1985 21:10-EST (Wednesday)
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 26

Short form answers follow.  I'm under the weather
at the moment (food poisoning? bubonic plague?)

> 1)    how do you get news to the earthstation that talks on the
>       uplink to the satellite?

 Via the most direct paths possible.  My personal model is that direct
 dialup to the moderator's machines (which might well be a Stargate
 funded centralized machine or machines) would be the most efficient.
 Remember, only ONE copy of a message needs to be sent this way--the
 original message.  It turns out that 800 numbers (and/or similar
 mechanisms) may well be viable if deemed desirable.  While messages
 COULD still be submitted by multi-path hops, direct input would
 keep the input time lag to a minimum.  The really nice part is
 that OUTPUT time lag is VERY small, since the broadcast cycle reaches
 all receiving sites simultaneously.  More details on request.

> 2)    who pays for the hardware?  it is a capital expenditure
>       that is larger than most monthly phone bills, but smaller than
>       a new CPU.

 I did a variety of surveys on this topic.  There are many sites for
 whom the capital expenditure would be trivial.  In fact, I got a number
 of sites saying, "Where do I send my money to order a Stargate receiver?"
 even based on initial info about the experiment.  For sites who cannot
 justify the expenditure (which, by the way, should drop considerably
 in amount as time goes by and mass equipment production goes up) my plan
 is that equipment rentals would be available.  So, sites would have the
 option of either buying the equipment and paying only the monthly
 subscription fee, or of renting the equipment also.  In either case, the
 intention is for the overall monthly costs to be quite low.
 Stargate represents a continuous 24 hr/day data flow!  The cost per
 byte will be very low and the ability to reach all receiving sites
 simultaneously and rapidly will be very great.

More details when I'm feeling better or upon request.

--Lauren--



From [email protected]  Mon Dec 16 23:07:52 1985
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From: Wombat <[email protected]>
Message-Id: <8512160225.AA14417@pucc-j>
To: usenet-II%[email protected]
Subject: Posting restrictions
Received: from CSNet-Relay by Gatech; 16 Dec 85 21:53:14-EST (Mon)
Status: O
X-Status:
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If you would like a copy of our local hacks which restrict who-can-post-
to-what-newsgroup, I'd be happy to run some diffs for you and send
them along (we run 2.10.3, but the same code worked under 2.10.1).
In short, we maintain a file, /usr/local/lib/news/restrict, which
is of the form (in fact, this is it!):

net.test network,news,acu,rsk
net.all network,news staff,consult,operator
mod.all network,news
pucc.news network,news staff
pucc.staff network,news staff
pucc.consult network,news staff,consult
control network,news,root,acu,rsk

The first field is the newsgroup(s); the second is a list of users who
are allowed to post; the third is a list of groups who are allowed to
post.  The actual determination of whether or not a certain person is
determined by the union of fields 2 and 3; i.e. I'm in group staff,
and may therefore post to net.all, pucc.news, pucc.staff, and pucc.consult;
but I'm rsk, and may therefore post to net.test and control.  I can't
post to mod.all.  (without su'ing to news, at least.)

Rich Kulawiec, Purdue University Computing Center

From spaf  Tue Dec 17 01:44:36 1985
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Date: Tue, 17 Dec 85 01:30:43 EST
From: Gene Spafford <spaf>
Posted-Date: Tue, 17 Dec 85 01:30:43 EST
Received-Date: Tue, 17 Dec 85 01:30:43 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: usenet-II
Subject: Re:  Posting restrictions
Status: RO
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 28

I wrote the code in 2.10.3 news (at least it is in the beta4.3 version)
which is defined by the symbol FACIST in the defs.h file.  When this
code is present, it looks up user names in an authorization file and
limits the groups to which someone can post.  The syntax is similar to
the fields in the "sys" file which determine which newsgroups get passed.

Furthermore, the FACIST symbol itself can be used to assign a default
set of postable groups to all users.  Selected users can be granted
wider posting authority by including an appropriate line in the
authorization file.

If you have a 2.10.3 test version, see if the symbol FACIST is in
your code.

--gene

From seismo!uiucdcs!ccvaxa!preece  Tue Dec 17 13:06:05 1985
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Date: 17 Dec 1985 08:26-CST
From: seismo!uiucdcs!ccvaxa!preece (Scott E. Preece)
Subject: Re:  Posting restrictions
To: [email protected]
Message-Id: <503677616/preece@fang>
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 29

Notes has a built in access control system that allows
granting reading/writing/responding/director access
to specific users, groups, and systems, either by
inclusion or exclusion.  On a file-by-file basis,
of course.  Only users with director
access can change the access list.

We've also extended our local notes system to know
about 'monitors' -- users who are notified by mail
of all new postings to a notesfile.

As an example of the way we use this, we use notesfiles
to maintain bug reports.  We have utilities allowing users
to build a bug report and mail it to the appropriate
bug notesfile.  Everyone can post things in the notesfile,
but only the director (who would be listed as a monitor and
would be notified by mail of incoming bug reports) can
read it.  The director vets the incoming bug reportsfor
duplication, foreknowledge, and completeness, attaches an
analysis of the likely nature of the problem and its priority,
mails a copy of the report and analysis to the person
who originated the bug report, assigns the
bug to someone for resolution, and moves the note to a
different notesfile, where everyone can read it and
respond to it.  The "director message" toggle (which is
visible from the index display as well as when viewing a
particular note) is used to mark bug reports which have
been resolved.  It can be set only by the director.  When
the fixer has posted the resolution of the problem, as a
response to the bug report note, the director toggles the
flag and mails the resolution note to the originator of the
bug report.

We've found this works pretty well.

--
scott preece
gould/csd urbana
arpa:   preece@gswd-vms
uucp:   ihnp4!uiucdcs!ccvaxa!preece

From spaf  Tue Dec 17 13:28:00 1985
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       id AA14327; Tue, 17 Dec 85 13:20:38 EST
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 85 13:20:38 EST
From: Gene Spafford <spaf>
Posted-Date: Tue, 17 Dec 85 13:20:38 EST
Received-Date: Tue, 17 Dec 85 13:20:38 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: usenet-II
Subject: Fowarded
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 30

[I was asked to forward this to the list, and it got buried in my mailbox.
I only read my mail about twice a week, when I need a break from the
thesis work.  My apologies if I take a while to answer your mail
(or forward items to the list) -- the thesis has to come first right now.
Anyhow, greatly delayed....
--gene]

I'd like to have an idea of how Usenet-II mailing list participants are working
with Usenet as it exists now.  Toward that end, I'd like you to send me a copy
of your own personal ".newsrc" file (or whatever its equivalent is on your
system); I'll create a summary showing what groups are and aren't being read,
and I'll send the summary to list participants.

Since there aren't too many folks on the list, the summary might look something
like:
                                  Respondents
               00000000011111111112222222222333333333344444444445
               12345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890 Have Read
..
net.flame       !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!   50    0
net.income      :::::     !!   :!     :               :              11    3
..

with the (obvious?) meaning.  (I envision that respondents would not be
identified by name, although someone with a knowledge of who is on the list
and of what "local" groups show up only on certain systems might deduce the
identities of some respondents.)

So. . .if you'd send along a copy of your ".newsrc" file to me at the address
below, along with suggestions on the form a summary might take, I'd appreciate
it.
--
       UUCP: ..decvax!seismo!elsie!ado    ARPA: [email protected]


From seismo!uiucdcs!ccvaxa!preece  Tue Dec 17 13:30:15 1985
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Posted-Date: 17 Dec 1985 08:26-CST
Received-Date: Tue, 17 Dec 85 12:49:06 EST
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Date: 17 Dec 1985 08:26-CST
From: seismo!uiucdcs!ccvaxa!preece (Scott E. Preece)
Subject: Re:  Posting restrictions
To: [email protected]
Message-Id: <503677616/preece@fang>
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 31

Notes has a built in access control system that allows
granting reading/writing/responding/director access
to specific users, groups, and systems, either by
inclusion or exclusion.  On a file-by-file basis,
of course.  Only users with director
access can change the access list.

We've also extended our local notes system to know
about 'monitors' -- users who are notified by mail
of all new postings to a notesfile.

As an example of the way we use this, we use notesfiles
to maintain bug reports.  We have utilities allowing users
to build a bug report and mail it to the appropriate
bug notesfile.  Everyone can post things in the notesfile,
but only the director (who would be listed as a monitor and
would be notified by mail of incoming bug reports) can
read it.  The director vets the incoming bug reportsfor
duplication, foreknowledge, and completeness, attaches an
analysis of the likely nature of the problem and its priority,
mails a copy of the report and analysis to the person
who originated the bug report, assigns the
bug to someone for resolution, and moves the note to a
different notesfile, where everyone can read it and
respond to it.  The "director message" toggle (which is
visible from the index display as well as when viewing a
particular note) is used to mark bug reports which have
been resolved.  It can be set only by the director.  When
the fixer has posted the resolution of the problem, as a
response to the bug report note, the director toggles the
flag and mails the resolution note to the originator of the
bug report.

We've found this works pretty well.

--
scott preece
gould/csd urbana
arpa:   preece@gswd-vms
uucp:   ihnp4!uiucdcs!ccvaxa!preece

From ulysses!burl!rcj  Tue Dec 17 15:08:53 1985
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From: <ulysses!burl!rcj>
Posted-Date: Tue, 17 Dec 85 14:50:03 est
Received-Date: Tue, 17 Dec 85 15:02:14 EST
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Date: Tue, 17 Dec 85 14:50:03 est
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: ihnp4!seismo!elsie!ado, ulysses!gatech!usenet-II
Subject: Re:  Fowarded
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 32

I don't really see how getting the .newsrc from all the usenet-II folks
will have any bearing on reality re: a new world-wide usetnet-II -- perhaps
I missed something?  Seems to me that what the administrators choose to read
should have little or (preferrably) no bearing on usenet-II.

Comments?

The MAD Programmer -- 919-228-3313 (Cornet 291)
alias: Curtis Jackson   ...![ ihnp4 ulysses cbosgd mgnetp ]!burl!rcj
                       ...![ ihnp4 cbosgd akgua masscomp ]!clyde!rcj



From [email protected]  Thu Dec 19 23:09:55 1985
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         19 Dec 85 10:46 EST
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Message-Id: <[email protected]>
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 85 10:46:20 est
From: Liudvikas Bukys <[email protected]>
To: usenet-II%[email protected]
Subject: Re: Posting restrictions
Received: from CSNet-Relay by Gatech; 19 Dec 85 21:29:34-EST (Thu)
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 33

The FASCIST option is still pretty helpless against people who know how
to uux a remote rnews command.  But it's a start.

It's also no help in cutting off abuse from other machines.  A
successful future-net should provide admins enough control over their
own machines to be able to cut off abuse by people like Rich Rosen.
(Whatever you think of his opinions, consistent consumption of ~10% of
total news bandwidth is unreasonable.)

Liudvikas Bukys
rochester!bukys
bukys@rochester

P.S.  Why is it that nobody can spell "fascist"?  Thanks, Rick, for
fixing that, though you'd better check again, as 4.3beta contains a mix
of "fascist" and "facist".

From ut-sally!im4u!jsq%zotz.UTEXAS.EDU  Fri Dec 20 20:35:19 1985
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Date: Thu, 19 Dec 85 09:29:29 cst
From: ut-sally!im4u!jsq%zotz.UTEXAS.EDU (John Quarterman)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
Received: by zotz.UTEXAS.EDU (2.0/4.22)
       id AA20278; Thu, 19 Dec 85 09:29:29 cst
To: [email protected]
Subject: moderators and transport mechanisms
Cc: [email protected]
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 34

A few opinions on moderators and transport mechanisms for the new network.

It's become clear that if the new network is to be of the same scale
as the old one as far as human participants that most of the newsgroups
will have to be moderated.  This is because so few people understand
the responsibility inherent in anarchy:  too many want to force
somebody else to bear the costs of transport and administration.
(Most of the participants of this list don't understand anarchy either,
judging by what they've written, but that's another discussion.)

However, of the terms available, such as host, moderator, leader,
catalyst, facilitator, editor, censor, inquisitor, etc., moderator
is not an especially good one.  I (and presumably others) think of
a moderator as being more or less equivalent to a talk show host,
and only one step more formal than the old model of USENET as a
continuous cocktail party.  To many people the word moderator is
unfamiliar and they think it means censor (we all know it doesn't,
but...).

When I mentioned the idea of USENET-II to a faculty member here, he
immediately thought of it as a publishing medium.  Newsgroups would be
analogous to journals.  There might be several of differing slants,
quality, formality, etc.  on the same subject, just as there are CACM
and JACM (or UNIX World and UNIX Review).  People would consider it
prestigious to write articles suitable for the higher quality ones,
yet could probably be published more easily in the others.

The person to whom one would submit an article for such a newsgroup
should obviously be called an editor.  Everyone who reads a newspaper
or journal is familiar with it.  It seldom bears connotations of
censorship.  It is a term of the print media, not of verbal discussions,
and would thus help steer the new network away from one of the problems
of the old:  the misconception that posting an article to the network
is no different from joining in a verbal discussion over lunch.


Another of the problems of the existing network is UUCP.  I don't
know about the rest of you, but I spend more time fiddling with
UUCP connections to get them to work than I do making the news
software work.  This is not a fault of the implementation (thanks,
Rick, et al) but of the design of UUCP and the dialup nature of
the links.  No doubt UUCP will still be common for transmissions
of city-wide distances, i.e, where there's no existing LAN but
not far enough for the telephone bills to justify anything better.
However, for long distance links it's a real lose on several accounts.

I understand Henry's point that UUCP is readily available and all,
but TCP/IP dialup links using SLIP are becoming as easy to set up,
and don't require anything bigger than a workstation to use do so.
I think they are the way to go for long-distance mail links,
and such long-distance news links as still are land-bound.

Given the above publishing model for the new news network, Stargate is
a good fit for a transport mechanism.  I think we should use it.  Even
when we have to start paying for the uplink service (we can't assume
SSI will be generous forever), it should be cheaper to collect fees
from those with receivers (who would collect from those they locally
redistribute to) than to support the current telephone networks.  It
would certainly be easier to run.


The new network needs a new name.  If we use the publishing model
and the Stargate transport mechanism, those will make it technically
different.  But we need something else to emphasize the differences and
make users who nothing of the technical issues know that this is not
USENET anymore.  The new SLIP-based CSNET offshoot is called Cypress.
We could be pompous and call ours Ygdrassil (the tree which supports
the world in Norse mythology), but nobody could spell it.  I propose
the name Banyan:  a large tree with one trunk, many widespread roots,
and far reaching branches.

From seismo!vortex!lauren  Sun Dec 22 01:42:30 1985
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Posted-Date: Sat, 21-Dec-85 11:43:22 PST
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Date: Sat, 21-Dec-85 11:43:22 PST
From: seismo!vortex!lauren (Lauren Weinstein)
Subject: Stargate Milestones
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: vortex!gatech!usenet-II
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 35

Several important events have occurred recently regarding Stargate,
all of them good.

First of all, SSS is now about ready to switch the Stargate feed from the
expensive old decoders to the cheaper, newer decoders which are now becoming
available.  I hope to have a number of them shortly for distribution.

Next, word has arrived from the decoder manufacturer that work is
proceeding on the next generation of decoders, which will be even
less expensive than the "current" new ones.  The next generation will
combine the cable demod with the data decoder in one little box instead
of having them separate in two little boxes (which is the current
design).

Very good news:

You've all heard me speak of the Stargate "buffer box."  This is the
little gadget that would sit on the output of the decoder and handle
flow control to mainframes, error correction and message updating,
message selection/control, and various other functions.  Quite some
time ago, a commercial firm hearing about Stargate (who felt that
as a non-profit enterprise Stargate deserved support) gave me a call.
They were designing a prototype standalone 68000 box (which would
cost them very little to build--and would be even cheaper
if it got into Far East mass production).  They wanted to know what
changes they could make in the initial design that would make it
more usable for Stargate, and offered to make them available to
Stargate AT COST if they got into fullscale manufacturing.

Well, I've just received word that the next stage in the approval
process has been reached, and they'll be sending me one of the
prototypes very shortly.  It appears likely that mass production
will follow unless some surprise snag appears.

Needless to say, I am *very* pleased at this news.  One thing I could
really use right now would be some people who consider themselves
to be good at 68000 development to help design the code to run on
these boxes!  I do not consider myself to be a 68000 wizard, particularly
in standalone environments like the box, so this is a definite call
for assistance!  Help!

------

On non-technical fronts, various work is proceeding on the issues
of funding, legal issues (after all, such a service really *does*
amount to publishing), and a variety of other factors.  Please contact
me if you wish more information on details in this area.

Somebody was wondering about names.  Frankly, for Stargate, I like
Stargate!  I chose the name because I personally thought it was
nifty originally, but I've found that it attracts the imagination
of people quickly and has helped a lot in gaining attention and
offers of assistance.  Even if some links are not satellite-based
(and I personally feel that UUCP is perfectly adequate for telephone-
based links--I don't see any need to use something different) the
name Stargate would still be useful.  However, I have been trying to
come up with some name to go after Stargate.  That is,
Stargate (blank).  Stargate Info Service?  Stargate Data Service?
Well, you get the idea, there have gotta be better choices than
those two but that still start with "Stargate."

By the way, SSS has expressed willingness to consider being the
billing agent for all sites.  They already handle the billing of
cable companies and subscribers for the various commercial
services they operate to something like 2000 cable companies,
so they already have all the mechanisms for dealing with
billing in place and ready to go.  It's worth thinking about, anyway.

Anyway, the non-technical aspects are still moving along well, and
it looks like the technical aspects are also coming together, so
I'm pretty upbeat on the future of Stargate.  Concepts and plans
for the coordination of information (that is, the "electronic journals"
published via Stargate) and moderators, etc. are areas where I
definitely would like to see some discussion.  I have some ideas
of my own (and there are important legal issues which must be
considered) but I have to make some formal plans sometime soon
in this area!  Help!

---

Remember, if you're a 68000 wizard, please let me know!  And if you
want to get an early decoder for experimentation, please drop me
a line so I can put you on the interest list.  Thanks.

--Lauren--


From seismo!polaris!herbie  Sun Dec 22 01:44:39 1985
Received: from seismo.UUCP by gatech.GTNET with UUCP (4.30GT/6.2.GT)
       id AA10395; Sun, 22 Dec 85 01:27:33 EST
From: <seismo!polaris!herbie>
Posted-Date: 21-Dec-1985 19:49-EST (Saturday)
Received-Date: Sun, 22 Dec 85 01:27:33 EST
Received: from polaris.UUCP by seismo.CSS.GOV with UUCP; Sat, 21 Dec 85 20:34:04 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
Date: 21-Dec-1985 19:49-EST (Saturday)
To: [email protected]
Subject: BITNET membership criteria (FYI only)
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 36

for those who have never seen this.  IBM is a Class D institution,
i believe.

Herb Chong...

I'm still user-friendly -- I don't byte, I nybble....
---------------------------

BITNET Network Information Center              (INFO@BITNIC)
____________________________________________________________
EDUCOM         PO Box 364, Princeton NJ 08540   609-734-1878


             Criteria for BITNET Membership


GENERAL MEMBERSHIP CATEGORIES

BITNET membership criteria include four classifications (see
below for complete description):

Class A members     degree-granting institutions

Class B members     consortia of institutions of higher edu-
                   cation

Class C members     nonprofit  organizations  serving higher
                   education

Class D members     industrial,  government,  or  commercial
                   organizations  with substantial links to
                   higher education

USAGE GUIDELINES

All usage of BITNET must be consistent with its goal to  fa-
cilitate  the exchange of non-commercial information in sup-
port of a member  institution's  mission  of  education  and
research.  In addition, all transmissions must either origi-
nate or terminate at the account of a person affiliated with
a BITNET member institution of Class A, B, or C.

PROCEDURES FOR JOINING

All  requests  to  join  BITNET must be submitted to and re-
viewed by the BITNET Network Information Center  at  EDUCOM.
Requests  meeting Class A membership criteria will be certi-
fied by the BITNET Network Information Center, and all other
requests will be brought before the BITNET  Membership  Com-
mittee  for approval via electronic mail.  Committee members
will be given two weeks to respond. If any committee  member
responds  unfavorably,  the  reasons for the unfavorable re-
sponse will be circulated among the committee and  the  mem-
bership  request  will  be brought up for a majority vote of
the committee.   An abstention  is  considered  a  favorable
vote.   Voting is conducted via electronic mail.  Again, the
committee is given two weeks to respond.

NETWORK CONNECTIONS TO BITNET

Other networks connected to BITNET by gateways  are  classi-
fied  as  either A or D members.  University networks may be
Class A members, and networks with  any  commercial  members
will fall into the Class D category.

SUBNODES

Institutional subnodes of type 2 or 3 (see Node Types below)
may  be  operated by Class A or B members, provided the node
is wholly owned and operated by the university.  The subnode
must accept any messages from BITNET  and  must  not  charge
BITNET for any messages it sends or receives.

NODE TYPES

Type 1    Node  type  1  is connected to BITNET via a leased
         line dedicated to BITNET  and  operating  at  9600
         baud or higher.  It runs the full RSCS or NJE pro-
         tocol  or  emulates  it.   It has a 9600 baud port
         available for linking a Class A  or  B  member  to
         BITNET  upon  request.    It  operates at least 20
         hours a day, 7 days a  week,  except  for  unusual
         circumstances.    The  management  is committed to
         providing the hardware, software, and support ser-
         vices necessary to support BITNET traffic through-
         out the node.

Type 1A   Node type 1A is a type 1 node with additional  ca-
         pabilities  allowing  it  to screen traffic from a
         specific node so as to restrict BITNET  access  to
         authorized    people   and   to   enforce   BITNET
         non-commercial use rules.

Type 2    Node type 2 is a node which does not meet  all  of
         the criteria for a type 1 node.

Type 3    Node  type  3 is a type 2 node which serves a lim-
         ited clientele and which is restricted to  serving
         that  clientele exclusively.  That is, it must not
         originate or receive BITNET traffic  destined  for
         another  node  or for individuals outside the lim-
         ited clientele the node  has  been  authorized  to
         serve.

MEMBERSHIP CLASSES

Class A   A  Class  A  member is a nonprofit degree-granting
         institution of higher education.   An  institution
         based  in  the United States must be accredited by
         the appropriate regional accrediting organization;
         others must grant degrees acceptable to  U.S.  in-
         stitutions  as  appropriate foundation for further
         study in U.S. institutions.  Class A members  must
         maintain a BITNET node of type 1 or 1A.

         An institution meeting the criteria for Class A or
         B  membership  may join BITNET by connecting to an
         available port provided by a Class A or B  member.
         It is the responsibility of the BITNET member pro-
         viding  the connection to verify that the new mem-
         ber  meets  all  of  the   criteria   for   BITNET
         membership.

         Applicants meeting all of the criteria for Class A
         or B membership except for the ability to maintain
         a  type 1 node, may be granted provisional Class A
         or B membership for a period of one year by unani-
         mous vote  of  the  BITNET  Membership  Committee.
         When  a new site wants to connect, the provisional
         Class A or B node must upgrade.  These connections
         will be treated as institutional subnodes  and  do
         not  relieve  the sponsor of the responsibility to
         provide at least one Class A or  B  connection  to
         BITNET.  Renewal requires a new vote.

Class B   A Class B member is an organization devoted exclu-
         sively  to  scholarly  research  and operated by a
         consortium of  institutions  of  higher  education
         which  meets  the criteria for Class A membership.
         Class B members must maintain  a  BITNET  node  of
         type 1 or 1A.

         For  more  information  concerning Class B member-
         ship, see references under Class A, above.

Class C   A Class C member is a nonprofit organization whose
         purpose is to advance the interests of higher edu-
         cation.  The majority of the members of its  board
         of  trustees  must be employees of institutions of
         higher education.  Class C members must maintain a
         BITNET node of type 3.

         An organization may become a  Class  C  member  by
         finding a Class A or B member willing to provide a
         connection port and sponsor the organization's re-
         quest  for  membership.   Sponsorship responsibil-
         ities include verifying  that  the  applicant  for
         Class  C membership meets the eligibility require-
         ments and is capable of operating a type  3  node.
         Granting  a  port to a Class C member does not re-
         lieve the Class A member from the  requirement  to
         provide  a connection to at least one Class A or B
         member upon request.  Membership is granted when a
         majority of the membership committee approves.

Class D   A Class D member is a government,  commercial,  or
         nonprofit  organization  with substantial research
         links to institutions of higher education.   Class
         D members must be connected to a Class A or B mem-
         ber  operating a type 1A node, and must maintain a
         type 3 node.

         An organization may become a  Class  D  member  by
         finding a Class A or B member willing to provide a
         connection port, sponsor the organization, and op-
         erate a type 1A node.  Class D membership and mem-
         bership   renewal   are  provisional  upon  a  2/3
         majority vote by the membership committee.    Mem-
         bership may be renewed annually upon certification
         of  the sponsoring Class A member that the traffic
         originating from the Class D node  has  been  con-
         sistent  with  the  principles of BITNET.   Ten or
         more Class A or B members can petition for the re-
         call of a Class D membership.   Other members  are
         responsible for the conduct of Class D members who
         are  using  accounts at their institutions.  Other
         BITNET nodes are not required to add Class D nodes
         to their routing tables, and therefore  may  block
         the flow of a Class D member's traffic.


BITNET Network Information Center              (INFO@BITNIC)
____________________________________________________________
EDUCOM         PO Box 364, Princeton NJ 08540   609-734-1878

From spaf  Sat Dec 28 21:19:46 1985
Received: by gatech.GTNET (4.30GT/6.2.GT)
       id AA08636; Sat, 28 Dec 85 21:08:11 EST
Date: Sat, 28 Dec 85 21:08:11 EST
From: Gene Spafford <spaf>
Posted-Date: Sat, 28 Dec 85 21:08:11 EST
Received-Date: Sat, 28 Dec 85 21:08:11 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: usenet-ii
Subject: spelling, and comments
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 37

1) Thanks to all of you sending me mail about my spelling of "fascist".
I believe I spelled it correctly in the code I wrote for 2.10.3, or
maybe Rick corrected my spelling -- I don't know.  I do know that
a) the code is there, and b) I've been called a "net-facist" for
so long that that incorrect spelling is beginning to look correct to
me.

2) Many of you have written to me asking why I haven't said more
on the issues being discussed in the mailing list, especially seeing
as I started the list up and had some things from previous discussions
I wanted to toss into the fray.  Simple, one word answer: thesis.
I'm in my last 4-6 weeks of PhD thesis work, and I have some deadlines to
meet.  I don't have the time to really write out the kind of thoughtful,
considered submissions I'd like.  Hell, I don't even have time to answer
all my mail these days.  If all goes well, I will defend my
thesis in a little over a month and then join the research faculty
here.  At that time, I will reread the archives to the list
and start submitting, if what I want to say has not already been
said by some of you.

Ray Essick has dropped out of the list for basically the same reasons.

Happy 1986,
--gene


From ucbarpa.berkeley.edu@hplabs!ucbvax!fair  Sun Dec 29 20:46:40 1985
Received: from hplabs.UUCP by gatech.GTNET with UUCP (4.30GT/6.2.GT)
       id AA24472; Sun, 29 Dec 85 20:44:06 EST
Posted-Date: Fri, 27 Dec 85 10:50:29 PST
Received-Date: Sun, 29 Dec 85 20:44:06 EST
Received: by hplabs.ARPA ; Sun, 29 Dec 85 14:52:21 pst
Received: by ucbvax.berkeley.edu (5.31/1.7)
       id AA13554; Fri, 27 Dec 85 10:50:34 PST
Received: by ucbarpa (5.31/1.7)
       id AA05382; Fri, 27 Dec 85 10:50:29 PST
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 85 10:50:29 PST
From: ucbarpa.berkeley.edu@hplabs!ucbvax!fair (Erik E. Fair)
Message-Id: <8512271850.AA05382@ucbarpa>
To: hplabs!gatech!usenet-II
Subject: Re:  moderators and transport mechanisms
Cc: [email protected]
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 38

Hmm. `Ygdrassil' has a neat ring to it, but then I'm of Norwegian descent.
I suppose that makes us agents of Loki...

Beware of `banyan,' since there is a computer company by that name which
might object to the usurpation of the name. Unless they've gone under
already.

Who am I? Yes, that bears answering: I'm Erik Fair, technical
consultant to the USENIX Association (for now), late of Dual Systems,
and UC Berkeley.  I first used version A netnews on the Cory Hall
PDP-11/70 in the spring of 1981 while Matt Glickman was busy developing
B news on the ucbonyx system.

After Mark Horton left Berkeley, the Onyx fell into my hands (after
some amount of political wrangling), and I ran netnews on it (B 2.8)
for a year. I left UCB (but not berkeley) to join Dual Systems in March
of 1983 and brought networking of all kinds to them, including
netnews.  I was at the Washington D.C. UniForum conference where the
UUCP Project madness was started (wow! 60 people crammed into a small
room arguing over how to organize domains, when no software existed to
do it). At that same conference I convinced Bob Henry to let me run
netnews on ucbvax (since it was killing the machine, and I asserted
that I could fix it), and I have been doing so ever since.

I left Dual last May, and spent the summer hacking on recnews to get
the ARPANET gatewaying `just' right, and doing some research into text
retrieval systems, and How Better To Structure The Net. I posted some
of my conclusions in an article last September in net.news called
`Information Overload and What We Can Do About It.' Unfortunately, I
mentioned keywords, and the ensuing debate degenerated into one over
the feasability of keywords, rather than on some of my more salient
points.

In the next issue of the USENIX Association newsletter `;login:' there
will be an expanded version of what I posted in September. Hopefully
paper publication will push my point a bit more effectively than
posting to the network did.

I am of the opinion that the current network can be saved with some
careful applications of software technology. I know it's a damn sight
easier to program a computer than it is to program 10,000 people...

       Erik E. Fair    ucbvax!fair     [email protected]

P.S.    Maybe we should ask Dave Presotto to borrow the name `upas' for
       our new network.

From seismo!elsie!ado  Mon Dec 30 17:53:00 1985
Received: from seismo.UUCP by gatech.GTNET with UUCP (4.30GT/6.2.GT)
       id AA03662; Mon, 30 Dec 85 17:40:34 EST
From: <seismo!elsie!ado>
Posted-Date: Mon, 30 Dec 85 13:49:02 EST
Received-Date: Mon, 30 Dec 85 17:40:34 EST
Received: from elsie.UUCP by seismo.CSS.GOV with UUCP; Mon, 30 Dec 85 13:49:02 EST
Date: Mon, 30 Dec 85 13:49:02 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: .newsrc
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 39

As promised, here's the summary of ".newsrc" files mailed to me by folks on the
Usenet-II list.  The summary is restricted to "net" and "mod" groups.
Seventeen folks (about one-third of the folks on the list) responded.

There are 48 "mod" groups listed; an average of ~6.9 people subscribe to
each one.  There are 200 "net" groups listed; an average of ~4.7 people
subscribe to each one.  The difference in subscriptions might be evidence for
the oft-expressed notion that folks find more value in moderated groups than
they do in unmoderated ones.  (It might also be accounted for by the fact that
"net" groups are usually narrower in scope than "mod" groups and therefore
attract less of a following.)

Numbers of groups subscribed to ranged from 29 to 197; the average is about 74
groups.  Everyone subscribes to some "nontechnical" groups, though in some
cases the subscriptions are to dormant groups and may not reflect actual
reading.

The groups are listed alphabetically below; you can do a
       sort -n -r +2
to get a "by readership" list.  The top dozen groups (15 or 16 subscribers):
       mod.newslists
       mod.sources
       mod.unix
       net.announce
       net.bugs
       net.news
       net.news.adm
       net.news.b
       net.news.config
       net.news.group
       net.news.sa
       net.sources
Note that all the top groups are (in my book, anyway) technical.
Note also that despite its problems, "net.sources" appears in the list.

Thanks to everyone who responded.

                               --ado

                                       17 respondents
                                      00000000011111111
Group                        Have Read 12345678901234567
mod.adm.checkgroups             1    1              :
mod.ai                         12    5 :::  !! :! !!! :!
mod.compilers                   2    2            ::
mod.computers                  11   11 ::   : ::::::: :
mod.computers.apollo           10    4 ! :  :: :  !!! !!
mod.computers.gould             4    2       : :!      !
mod.computers.ibm-pc           12    3 : :: !! !! !!! !!
mod.computers.laser-printers   15   10 ::: ::: :!:!!::!!
mod.computers.macintosh        11    8 : :  :: : :!:: !!
mod.computers.pyramid          12    8 ! :  :: :::!:: !!
mod.computers.ridge            11    3 !    :: :!!!!! !!
mod.computers.sequent          11    6 !    :: :!!!:: :!
mod.computers.sun              14    9 : : ::: ::!!!::!!
mod.computers.vax              13    4 : :  !! :!!!!:!!!
mod.computers.works             2    2         :  :
mod.computers.workstations     12    7 :   ::: ::!!!: !!
mod.general                     3    3 :     : :
mod.graphics                    9    7 :    :: :  :!: :!
mod.human-nets                 13   11 ::::::: :  :!: :!
mod.legal                      12    7 !::  :! :: :!: !!
mod.map                        15   11 !::  !::::::!:::!
mod.map.news                    2    1         :     !
mod.map.uucp                    4    3         :::   !
mod.motss                      14    7 : !: :!!::!!:! !:
mod.movies                     14   11 :::: :!!: !::: ::
mod.music                      15    5 ! !: !!!:!!!!!:::
mod.newprod                    14   13 ::::::: : :::: :!
mod.newslists                  17   16 ::::::::::::::!::
mod.politics                   13    5 !:: :!:!:!  !! !!
mod.politics.arms-d            12    3 : ! :!: !! !!! !!
mod.protocols                  13   11 :::  :: :::::: !!
mod.protocols.appletalk        13    5 ! :  ::::!!!!! !!
mod.protocols.kermit           12    3 ! :  !! :!!!!: !!
mod.protocols.tcp-ip           14    7 ! :  :::!:!!!!::!
mod.rec                         9    9 : :  : ::  ::: :
mod.rec.guns                   12    5 ! ! :!::!  !:: !!
mod.recipes                     9    4 !    !!::  !::  !
mod.risks                      12   10 :  :::: : :::! :!
mod.singles                     2    1         : !
mod.sources                    17   15 ::::::::::::::!:!
mod.std                        13   10 !!:  ::::: ::: :!
mod.std.c                      16   11 ::!: :::::::!:!!!
mod.std.mumps                  14    2 ! !: !!:!!!!!! !!
mod.std.unix                   15   13 :::  :::::::!:::!
mod.telecom                    13    8 !::  :: ::!:!: !!
mod.test                       14   10 :!:  :!:::!::: :!
mod.unix                       16   15 :::: :::::::::!::
mod.vlsi                       11    3 ! :  :! :! !!! !!
net..arch                       1    0             !
net.abortion                   14    1 ! !: !!!!!!!!! !!
net.ai                         15    5 ::!: !!!:!!!!! :!
net.analog                     14    3 ! :: !:!!!!!!! !!
net.announce                   17   16 ::::::::::::::!::
net.announce.arpa-internet     14   11 :::  :: :!:!::::!
net.announce.newusers          15   10 : !: :!!::!:::::!
net.applic                      1    1           :
net.arch                       13    8 : :: ::!:!:! : !!
net.astro                      14    4 ! :: !!!:!!:!! !!
net.astro.expert               14    4 ! :: !!!:!!:!! !!
net.audio                      14    2 ! !: !!:!!!!!! !!
net.auto                       14    2 ! !::!!!! !!!! !!
net.auto.tech                  11    1 ! !  !! :! !!! !!
net.aviation                   14    2 ! !: !!!!!!:!! !!
net.bicycle                    14    3 ! !: !!!!!::!! !!
net.bio                        14    3 : !: !!!!!!:!! !!
net.bio.slime                   2    1  !      :
net.bizarre                     3    0      !   !    !
net.books                      15    6 : :: !!!:!!:!!!:!
net.bugs                       17   15 :::::::::!::::::!
net.bugs.2bsd                  16   11 : :::!::!!:!::::!
net.bugs.4bsd                  16   13 : :::::::!:!::::!
net.bugs.usg                   15   10 : :: ::::!:!!::!!
net.bugs.uucp                  17   14 ::::::::::::!::!!
net.bugs.v7                    17   14 :::::::::!:::::!!
net.chess                       3    2 :    :  !
net.cog-eng                    15    7 :!:: !:!:!!:!: !!
net.college                    15    4 !!:: !!!:!!!!! :!
net.columbia                   14    7 ! :: !:!::!:!! !:
net.comics                     15    3 ! !: !:!!!!!!!:!!
net.consumers                  16    7 !!!::!!!::!:!: !:
net.cooks                      15    1 !!!: !!!!!!!!! !!
net.crypt                      14    8 : :: ::::!!!!: !!
net.cse                        15    5 :::: !!!:!!!!! !!
net.cycle                      15    2 ! !: :!!!!!!!!!!!
net.database                   13    5 : :  !!::!!!!: !!
net.dcom                       15   10 !::: :::::!:!: !!
net.decus                      14    6 : :: !!::!!!!: !!
net.emacs                      16    7 ! !:::!::!!!!::!!
net.eunice                     14    3 ! !: !!!:!!!!: !!
net.flame                       9    4 ! !: :!!: !:
net.followup                   16    9 :::: !!:::!::!!!!
net.games                      14    3 ! :: !!!!!!!!: !!
net.games.board                11    2  !!  !! :  :!!!!!
net.games.chess                11    6  ::  !! :  :!:!:!
net.games.emp                  15    6 ! :: !!:!!!!!:::!
net.games.frp                  15    4 ! !: !:!!!!!!::!!
net.games.go                   15    4 ! :: :!:!!!!!!!!!
net.games.hack                 13    3 ! !  !!:! !!!::!!
net.games.pbm                  15    1 ! !: !!!!!!!!!!!!
net.games.rogue                15    2 ! !: !!!!!!!!!!:!
net.games.trivia               15    2 ! !: !!!!!!:!!!!!
net.games.video                15    1 ! !: !!!!!!!!!!!!
net.garden                     15    1 !!!: !!!!!!!!! !!
net.general                    16   12 :::: :!:::!::::!!
net.graphics                   14    7 : :: ::!:!!!!: !!
net.ham-radio                  14    1 ! !: !!!!!!!!! !!
net.ham-radio.packet           10    3 ! :  :! :  !!! !!
net.info-terms                 15    7 :!:: ::!:!!!!: !!
net.internat                   12    6 :!   :: ::!:!! !!
net.invest                     14    4 ! !: :!!:!!!!: !!
net.jobs                       15    7 !!:: :!!:!::!: !!
net.jokes                      15    5 !!!: :!!:!!:!: !!
net.jokes.d                    15    3 !!!: !!!:!!:!! !!
net.kids                       15    4 !:!: !!!!:!:!! !!
net.lan                        14    9 ! :  ::::::!!::!!
net.lang                       13    5 : !  :!::!!:!! !!
net.lang.ada                   13    1 ! !  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.lang.apl                   13    3 ! !  :!!:!!:!! !!
net.lang.c                     15    8 :::  ::::!!:!!!!!
net.lang.f77                   13    4 ! !  :!!:!!!!: !:
net.lang.forth                 13    2 ! !  :!!:!!!!! !!
net.lang.lisp                  14    2 ! !  !!!:!!!!!!:!
net.lang.mod2                  13    3 ! !  :!!:!:!!! !!
net.lang.pascal                13    2 ! !  :!!:!!!!! !!
net.lang.prolog                14    3 !:!  !!!:!!!!! :!
net.lang.st80                  14    3 ! :  !!!:!:!!!!!!
net.legal                      15    6 !::: !!!:!!:!: !!
net.lsi                        13    3 ! :  :!!:!!!!! !!
net.mag                        14    4 ::!  :!!:!!!!! !!
net.mail                       17   12 :!:::::::::!!::!!
net.mail.headers               16    8 :!:: :!::!:!!:!!!
net.mail.msggroup               2    1         :     !
net.math                       13    2 : !  !!!!!!:!! !!
net.math.stat                  13    1 : !  !!!!!!!!! !!
net.math.symbolic              13    3 : !  :!!!!!!!! :!
net.med                        14    2 !!!  !!:!!!:!! !!
net.micro                      14    6 :!:  :::: !!!!!!!
net.micro.16k                  13    6 ! :  ::::!!!!: !!
net.micro.432                   1    1         :
net.micro.6809                 14    1 !!!  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.micro.68k                  14    6 ! :  ::::!!!!:!!!
net.micro.amiga                12    2 !!!  :! :!! !! !!
net.micro.apple                13    1 ! !  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.micro.atari                13    2 ! !  :!!:!!!!! !!
net.micro.att                  13    4 ! !  :!:::!!!! !!
net.micro.cbm                  13    0 ! !  !!!!!!!!! !!
net.micro.cpm                  13    0 ! !  !!!!!!!!! !!
net.micro.hp                   13    3 ! !  !:::!!!!! !!
net.micro.mac                  13    3 ! !  !!::!:!!! !!
net.micro.pc                   13    1 ! !  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.micro.ti                   13    1 ! !  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.micro.trs-80               13    2 ! !  !!::!!!!! !!
net.micro.zx                    1    1         :
net.misc                       15    6 :!:: !!::!!:!! !!
net.misc.coke                   1    0         !
net.motss                      13    2 : !  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.movies                     15    6 :!:  !!!:!!:!:!:!
net.music                      15    4 ! !: !!!:!!!!!!::
net.music.classical            15    2 ! !: !!!:!!!!!!!!
net.music.folk                 14    1 ! !  !!!:!!!!!!!!
net.music.gdead                14    2 ! !  !!!:!!!!!!!:
net.music.guitar                1    0          !
net.music.synth                15    3 ! ! :!!!:!!!!!!:!
net.net-people                 15   10 !::: :!::!!:!: ::
net.news                       16   16 :::: ::::::::::::
net.news.adm                   16   15 :::: :::::::::::!
net.news.b                     16   15 :::: :::::::::::!
net.news.config                16   15 :::: :::::::::!::
net.news.group                 17   16 ::::::!::::::::::
net.news.map                    1    0               !
net.news.newsite               15   12 :::  :!::!::::!::
net.news.notes                 13    8 :::  :! : !!:::!!
net.news.sa                    17   15 :::::::::::!::::!
net.news.stargate              16   13 :!: ::::::::::!:!
net.nlang                      14    3 :!!  !!!:!!:!! !!
net.nlang.africa               13    1 ! !  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.nlang.celts                13    1 ! !  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.nlang.greek                13    0 ! !  !!!!!!!!! !!
net.nlang.india                13    1 ! !  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.notes                       4    1       ! : !   !
net.oa                          1    0               !
net.origins                    13    0 ! !  !!!!!!!!! !!
net.os                          9    9 :: : : :: ::    :
net.periphs                    14   10 :::  ::::::!!: !!
net.pets                       13    1 ! !  !!!!!!:!! !!
net.philosophy                 13    1 ! :  !!!!!!!!! !!
net.physics                    14    3 :!:  !!!!!!:!! !!
net.poems                      13    2 ! !  :!!:!!!!! !!
net.politics                   15    3 !:!: !!!:!!!!! !!
net.politics.theory            12    1 ! !  !!!: !!!! !!
net.puzzle                     14    3 :!!  !!!:!!:!! !!
net.railroad                   13    3 : !  !!!:!!:!! !!
net.rec                        13    6 : :  !!!:!!:!: !:
net.rec.birds                  13    1 ! !  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.rec.boat                   13    2 ! !  !!!:!!!!! :!
net.rec.bridge                 14    4 :!!  !!!:!!:!! !:
net.rec.nude                   13    3 ! !  :!!:!!!!: !!
net.rec.photo                  13    2 ! !  !!!:!!:!! !!
net.rec.scuba                  13    2 ! !  !!!:!!!!: !!
net.rec.ski                    13    3 ! :  !!!:!!!!! !:
net.rec.skydive                13    1 ! !  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.rec.wood                   13    3 ! !  !!::!!:!! !!
net.religion                   15    3 !!!: !!!:!!:!! !!
net.religion.christian         15    3 !!!: !!!:!!:!! !!
net.religion.jewish            14    2 !:!  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.research                   14    9 :!:  :!:::::!: !!
net.roots                      14    2 !!:  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.rumor                      16    9 :!: ::!::!:!!:!!:
net.sci                        13    6 : :  !!!:!!:!: !:
net.sf-lovers                  14    5 : !: !!!:!!:!: !!
net.singles                    15    5 !!!: !!!:!!:!! ::
net.social                     15    7 :!:: :!!:!!:!! !:
net.sources                    17   15 :::::::::::!::::!
net.sources.bugs               15   13 :::  :::::::::!:!
net.sources.games              13    7 ! :  :!:: !!::!:!
net.sources.lock-up             2    1         :     !
net.sources.mac                14    3 ! !  :!!:!:!!!!!!
net.space                      14    5 :!:  !:!:!!:!! !!
net.sport                      14    2 !!!  !!!:!!!!! !:
net.sport.baseball             15    4 :!!: !!!:!!!!! !:
net.sport.football             13    3 ! !  !!!:!!!!! ::
net.sport.hockey               14    1 ! !  !!!:!!!!!!!!
net.sport.hoops                13    1 ! !  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.startrek                   14    5 : :: !!!:!!!!: !!
net.std                         3    2 :       :     !
net.suicide                    13    4 ! :  !!::!!!!! !:
net.taxes                      14    5 !:!  :!!::!!!: !!
net.test                       13    5 ! :  !!::!!!:: !!
net.text                       14    8 : :  ::::!!!!::!!
net.theater                     3    1 !       :     !
net.travel                     13    3 ! !  !!!:!!:!: !!
net.tv                         14    3 : !: !!!:!!!!! !!
net.tv.drwho                   13    2 ! !  !!!:!!!!! :!
net.tv.soaps                   15    2 !!!: !!!:!!!!! !!
net.tvro                        1    1       :
net.unix                       16   12 ::::::::: :!!:!:!
net.unix-wizards               16   13 ::::::::: :!::!:!
net.usenix                     16   14 :::: ::::::!!::::
net.usoft                       3    2 :       :     !
net.veg                        13    2 ! !  :!!:!!!!! !!
net.video                      15    6 ! :::!!!:!!:!: !!
net.vlsi                        1    1           :
net.wanted                     14    9 :::  :!::!:!:: !!
net.wanted.sources             15   10 :::  :!::!:!::!:!
net.wines                      13    2 ! :  !!!:!!!!! !!
net.wobegon                    14    4 : !: !!!:!:!!! !!
net.women                      15    3 !!!: !!!:!!:!! !!
net.works                      15    8 :!: :::!:!:!!: !!


From ut-sally!im4u!jsq%zotz.UTEXAS.EDU  Wed Jan  1 08:50:01 1986
Received: from ut-sally.UUCP by gatech.GTNET with UUCP (4.30GT/6.2.GT)
       id AA13880; Wed, 1 Jan 86 08:46:29 EST
Received-Date: Wed, 1 Jan 86 08:46:29 EST
Received: by sally.UTEXAS.EDU (4.22/4.22)
       id AA03837; Tue, 31 Dec 85 11:31:36 cst
Posted-Date: Tue, 31 Dec 85 10:33:22 cst
Received: from zotz.UTEXAS.EDU by im4u (4.22/4.22)
       id AA15667; Tue, 31 Dec 85 10:39:18 cst
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 85 10:33:22 cst
From: ut-sally!im4u!jsq%zotz.UTEXAS.EDU (John Quarterman)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
Received: by zotz.UTEXAS.EDU (2.0/4.22)
       id AA21959; Tue, 31 Dec 85 10:33:22 cst
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re:  moderators and transport mechanisms
Cc: [email protected], [email protected]
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 40

Lauren has a point that it would be convenient to name the network
after the satellite feed and call the whole thing Stargate.  That
name is already pretty well known and is expected to support something
different from USENET.  (I don't particularly care for the name, myself:
reminds me of the time Andy Porter renamed Algol to be Starship.  But
it fits most of the useful criteria.)


When I panned UUCP I forgot to mention the UUCP-related task on which
I spend the most time:  rebuilding the routing database.  Despite the
UUCP Project's heroic efforts and the ever-incredible slicing-dicing
pathalias, it's still easy to burn half a day fiddling with LOCAL vs. DEMAND
to get stuff routed right.  Then a major host like ihnp4 goes dead and
it all has to be done over again.  If I didn't have a CPU sink like im4u
to use for it, I shudder to think how long it would take.

Furthermore, UUCP demands a full-duplex link and then only uses half of
it.  (The other half just gets acks sent over it now and then.)


There seem to be no dissenting opinions on the desirability of a publishing
rather than a spoken word model for the new network.  Or maybe people just
haven't gotten back from vacation yet....


To answer the who are you question:  UUCP/USENET/other administrator
for ut-sally and im4u.  Sally imports news for this area (south, west,
and east Texas and southwestern Louisiana; Dallas-Fort Worth use notes
and get their feed elsewhere).  Sally and im4u are busy enough handling
news and mail so that I probably see most of the major kinds of problems,
but they don't have enough traffic (yet) to be swamped.  I wrote uuhosts
(new version should be out in a few weeks).  Moderator of a couple of
newsgroups.

A number of years experience with ARPANET, CSNET, UUCP, and USENET.
I don't go back as far on the latter three (1983) as some, but farther
on the former (1975) than most.  Local ARPA Internet domain and network
administrator and ARPANET and CSNET host liaison.  Author of Notable
Computer Networks writeup of a year and a half ago and of the new
version currently in progress.

I'd rather be writing code and papers than fiddling with UUCP routes....

From seismo!vortex!lauren  Thu Jan  2 06:11:41 1986
Received: from seismo.UUCP by gatech.GTNET with UUCP (4.30GT/6.2.GT)
       id AA22995; Thu, 2 Jan 86 06:02:38 EST
Posted-Date: Wed, 2-Jan-85 22:28:38 PST
Received-Date: Thu, 2 Jan 86 06:02:38 EST
Received: from vortex.UUCP by seismo.CSS.GOV with UUCP; Thu, 2 Jan 86 04:11:28 EST
Date: Wed, 2-Jan-85 22:28:38 PST
From: seismo!vortex!lauren (Lauren Weinstein)
Subject: misc.
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: vortex!gatech!usenet-II
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 41

UUCP has the outstanding attributes that it already exists, is WIDELY
accepted and used, is flexible, and can easily meet all necessary
criteria for our purposes.  I might point out that the "problem"
of maintaining routing data is not UUCP's problem!  It's the problem
of the TOPOLOGY of the network, regardless of transport mechanism.
If we all decided to set up direct UUCP links to some central machine(s),
such routing issues would not exist.  It's the fact that people have liked
having the ability to route through other sites (for one reason or
another) that causes routing to be complex.  But nobody is FORCED
to use such complex routing--direct routes can always be set up and
will work just fine.  Also, the "half-duplex" nature of UUCP is not
really relevant.  Even in our existing networks, traffic flow patterns
tend to be highly skewed.  In a Stargate model (that is, some site
without a receiver being fed from some other site) almost all traffic
would be TOWARD the site being fed, with only occasional traffic coming
back the other way (miniscule in comparison to the traffic in the other
direction).  In fact, since most inbound traffic would normally be
routed directly to some central site(s) rather than sent hop by hop,
the reverse traffic might be zero in most cases.  So I don't see a problem.

---

Early next week, I hope to receive word on some Stargate decoders,
after a conference call with the SSS corporate folks.
I've asked for 6-8 decoders to be distributed for free for the
time being.  Once they're in the field, I'd like to get some REAL
traffic flowing through the satellite--right now very old test
messages run endlessly over and over again....  Suggestions regarding the
sorts of traffic that should be sent during this period are
definitely welcome!

--Lauren--


From ut-sally!im4u!jsq%zotz.UTEXAS.EDU  Fri Jan  3 22:24:13 1986
Received: from ut-sally.UUCP by gatech.GTNET with UUCP (4.30GT/6.2.GT)
       id AA18971; Fri, 3 Jan 86 22:19:26 EST
Received-Date: Fri, 3 Jan 86 22:19:26 EST
Received: by sally.UTEXAS.EDU (4.22/4.22)
       id AA00390; Fri, 3 Jan 86 16:53:08 cst
Posted-Date: Fri, 3 Jan 86 15:20:15 cst
Received: from zotz.UTEXAS.EDU by im4u (4.22/4.22)
       id AA03308; Fri, 3 Jan 86 15:21:57 cst
Date: Fri, 3 Jan 86 15:20:15 cst
From: ut-sally!im4u!jsq%zotz.UTEXAS.EDU (John Quarterman)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
Received: by zotz.UTEXAS.EDU (2.0/4.22)
       id AA00296; Fri, 3 Jan 86 15:20:15 cst
To: SALLY.UTEXAS.EDU@seismo!vortex!lauren
Subject: Re:  misc.
Cc: [email protected]
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 42

There's not a great deal of use in starting up a long-running UUCP
argument again in yet another forum.  However, there are a few things
in Lauren's message which might be confusing to someone who doesn't
understand UUCP as well as he does.

       UUCP has the outstanding attributes that it already exists, is WIDELY
       accepted and used, is flexible, and can easily meet all necessary
       criteria for our purposes.

That's all true (except there are those of us who accept it only grudgingly).
However, ACSNET exists, is used to the total exclusion of UUCP in Australia,
is readily available for a nominal license fee, is flexible, etc.  And everyone
who has a Sun, ISI, Pyramid, Sequent, etc. machine has TCP/IP.

       I might point out that the "problem"
       of maintaining routing data is not UUCP's problem!

Sorry, but it is.  The ARPANET is a collection of point to point links.
The user never needs to know anything about this, however, because the
IMPS use an adaptive routing algorithm to dynamically determine the
best routes.  That is exactly what UUCP lacks.  It is true that ARPANET
has the advantage of much faster (generally) links than UUCP, but it
is not at all clear that a dynamic routing algorithm could not be implemented
for a network of slow dialup links such as UUCP.  Until it is, UUCP requires
the users (or the system administrators) to do explicit routing:  that is
clearly broken.  The domain system of the UUCP Project is a useful step,
but it's still a patch, not a solution.

       It's the problem of the TOPOLOGY of the network, regardless of
       transport mechanism.  If we all decided to set up direct UUCP
       links to some central machine(s), such routing issues would not exist.

Not every organization with a machine with UUCP links can afford the telephone
bills to send everything long distance.  It's not the existing topology,
it's the lack of adaptive routing.

       It's the fact that people have liked having the ability to
       route through other sites (for one reason or another) that
       causes routing to be complex.  But nobody is FORCED to use such
       complex routing--direct routes can always be set up and will
       work just fine.

People are indeed forced by the economics of the situation.

       Also, the "half-duplex" nature of UUCP is not really relevant.
       Even in our existing networks, traffic flow patterns tend to be
       highly skewed.

Mail traffic (through ut-sally at least) is highly bidirectional.
We pay twice as much for telephone connect time as we should have
to because UUCP is incapable of transfering in both directions at once.
I agree with you about news traffic.  Except for the backbone hosts,
which Stargate effectively replaces.

       In a Stargate model (that is, some site without a receiver
       being fed from some other site) almost all traffic would be
       TOWARD the site being fed, with only occasional traffic coming
       back the other way (miniscule in comparison to the traffic in
       the other direction).  In fact, since most inbound traffic
       would normally be routed directly to some central site(s)
       rather than sent hop by hop, the reverse traffic might be zero
       in most cases.  So I don't see a problem.

Good point.  But wouldn't most submission traffic go to the machines
of the moderators of the various newsgroups?  If so, you've either got
to require a submittor to have a direct UUCP connection to every
moderator's machine (impractical) or you're going to have the
submissions arriving by the usual indirect paths.  If not, you would
have to have your central machine be willing to subsidize
redistributing to the moderators.  It might be worth including the
costs for that in subscription fees, actually, and require anyone who
submits to foot the cost of the connection to the uplink machine.
Might make people think twice about their submissions beforehand.

As far as outgoing news traffic from Stargate, presumably most
redistribution from hosts with receivers to hosts without would
be by local links anyway, so the telephone costs would not be a
problem.  It's long distance links for which I think UUCP is
inappropriate.  In the case of Stargate there probably wouldn't
be many of those for the actual news transmission.

So, Stargate would seem to eliminate most of the duplex transfer
problem regarding news transfer (by replacing the backbone hosts).
However, that and the routing problem still apply to the mail network.

From seismo!vortex!lauren  Sat Jan  4 20:27:48 1986
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       id AA29855; Sat, 4 Jan 86 20:10:17 EST
Posted-Date: Sat, 5-Jan-85 12:43:11 PST
Received-Date: Sat, 4 Jan 86 20:10:17 EST
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Date: Sat, 5-Jan-85 12:43:11 PST
From: seismo!vortex!lauren (Lauren Weinstein)
Subject: more misc. (long)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: vortex!gatech!usenet-II
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 43

I look at it this way:

A communications network tends to be either centralized or decentralized.
If there are going to be some central machines, then routing is simplified,
regardless of the transport mechanism.  Neither centralized nor
decentralized networks have "all" the answers--some balancing between
the two might be ideal in many situations.  If a network is largely
going to be decentralized (for economic or other reasons) then routing,
at some level of complexity, is going to take place.   As we all know,
decentralized networks do have both advantages and disadvantages.

If people want decentralization and you've got a large network, the
managing of routing will always require some work, particularly
when you're dealing with lots of systems with different hardware,
communications capacities, loads, economic considerations, etc.
But it's a task that CAN be managed.  In our current mail
environment, routing is becoming increasingly automatic as use of
pathalias, domain software, and other tools are brought into play.
Nobody claims such tools handle everything perfectly--but
we're all learning how to use such tools more effectively as time goes on.
Given the economic and political realities of our environment, I feel
that our decentralized network serves well for mail.

While I feel that the existing *mail* network works fine, and
will be doing even better in the future, I think there
are some very simple things that could be done to make it work
even more smoothly--for example, the establishment of a couple of
central nodes with 800 numbers funded through some mechanism could
have a dramatic impact.  Mail volume really isn't all that high
(at least in comparison to netnews) and it would not take a tremendous
amount of capacity to provide a couple of centralized dialup machines
that could make life a lot easier.  The fact that we don't have such
centralized aids now is mainly POLITICAL, not TECHNICAL.

The problems I tend to see on the mail network are more often based
in sendmail table or mailing list table problems than
anything else, and occur on all channels, including TCP.
Given the fact that mailing lists have to maintained and
updated, there will always be some level of problems with any such
mechanisms.  But I think things are well under control overall.

Frankly, I think we're diverting ourselves from the area that really
needs our attention.  We should not be spending too much time on mail issues
right now.  The problem that exists right now is Usenet: NETNEWS.
Netnews grows as if it had a life of its own.  When a new site joins
the net, their mail traffic tends not to instantly affect thousands
of other sites.  But their netnews traffic DOES affect virtually
everyone, and this is the real problem.  Most of the problem CANNOT BE
SOLVED via technical means alone.  This is where the controversial topics
of moderators, editing, etc. come into play.  I feel it is THESE areas
to which we should be addressing most of our attention, because it is
netnews which threatens to drive sites off the network, possibly in the
manner of some administrator just yanking out the modems and saying
"we don't need to talk to these bozos... period."  Such things have
already happened.  Then people are REALLY cutoff from the outside world.

There is NO technical solution that can deal with ever growing netnews
traffic without moderation and some form of centralized or semi-centralized
controls.  Outside of the fact that you can fill any bandwidth with
enough garbage, few people are going to be willing to indefinitely pay
for that garbage, or spend the time to wade through it.  Presumably
all of us are familiar with these issues.

Within the very near future a number of decisions must be
made regarding Stargate which may be difficult to back
away from if we change our minds later.  My view is that Stargate is
obviously the ideal distribution mechanism for news-type items
(or even mail in some situations, more on that in another message)
for people who can put in the decoder.  Others can receive their
feeds from nearby sites, via whatever transport mechanisms they
choose.  Putting in the decoder directly will always be the preferred
choice, but the local feed option will need to be available.  Inbound
traffic would ideally be fed to centralized machine(s) [they need not
be very large] on which moderators could work directly, or they
would route directly from the central nodes to the moderators' local
machines.  My analysis indicates that getting material to the
moderators should not be a problem.  The moderators then directly
route the material to the Stargate uplink, which handles all the
nitty-gritty work of sequencing, error correction, etc., etc.

But as usual, we techies are sitting here arguing about technical
issues when we REALLY need to be discussing the non-technical factors
like who moderates, how is moderation controlled, how do subscriptions to
the service work, what sort of organization is in charge of all this,
what is the legal framework surrounding that organization, what sort
of material should be accepted for transmission, what sorts of moderation
and levels of moderation should take place, etc.?

It is THESE sorts of questions I must address VERY SOON with the satellite
people and with the existing organizations which have expressed interest
in helping to fund Stargate.  They have faith that the technical issues
can be worked out.  What they want is some answers to the NON-technical
questions that have to be considered before anything
can go ahead.  I am under a great deal of pressure to get answers
for these non-technical questions, and propose a plan of action for an
actual service, VERY soon.

If we could steer these discussions in the direction of the non-technical
issues, it would be of immense help right now, and would help to avoid
the possibility of our losing access to the satellite channels.  The
satellite people are still VERY enthusiastic, but unless they can be
shown that we are more than a bunch of techies without any sense
of anything non-technical they're going to start losing enthusiasm
very shortly.  So please, let's spend some time looking at the issues
of moderation, policy, funding, and other similar non-technical matters.
When necessary, I'll comment on the baseline factors that must be
factored in (like that the sorts of frameworks which have been suggested
to me by the satellite carrier and potential funding sources).

Thanks much.

--Lauren--


From seismo!elsie!ado  Mon Jan  6 11:13:25 1986
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       id AA07649; Mon, 6 Jan 86 10:56:00 EST
From: <seismo!elsie!ado>
Posted-Date: Mon, 6 Jan 86 10:31:18 EST
Received-Date: Mon, 6 Jan 86 10:56:00 EST
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Date: Mon, 6 Jan 86 10:31:18 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: more misc. (long)
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 44

> I think there are some very simple things that could be done to make it work
> even more smoothly--for example, the establishment of a couple of central
> nodes with 800 numbers funded through some mechanism could have a dramatic
> impact.

In view of Reverend Falwell's recent experience, it might be wise to make that a
900 number.
--
       UUCP: ..decvax!seismo!elsie!ado    ARPA: [email protected]
       DEC, VAX and Elsie are Digital Equipment and Borden trademarks


From ut-sally!im4u!jsq%zotz.UTEXAS.EDU  Mon Jan  6 14:44:23 1986
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Date: Mon, 6 Jan 86 11:56:47 cst
From: ut-sally!im4u!jsq%zotz.UTEXAS.EDU (John Quarterman)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
Received: by zotz.UTEXAS.EDU (2.0/4.22)
       id AA08434; Mon, 6 Jan 86 11:56:47 cst
To: SALLY.UTEXAS.EDU@seismo!vortex!lauren
Subject: Re:  more misc. (long)
Cc: [email protected]
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 45

I agree that news should be the primary topic of discussion.
I put in my two cents on the political issues earlier.

As to mail, you wrote a lot of good words, but never addressed
my central complaint:  managing routing in the UUCP mail network
requires far too much *human* intervention because the management
is grafted on as an afterthought instead of being part of the
design of the network.  That is the issue, not centralization
or decentralization, since it's clear the UUCP network is going
to be decentralized (even if you add "a few" 800 number sites,
you still have to know which ones to route to:  "a few" is not "one").
That mailing lists have a different set of problems is irrelevant.

But, you're right:  news is the main topic of interest in this list.
I'm waiting to read what others write, especially about the political
and economic issues.

From akgua!ihnp4!utzoo!henry  Mon Jan  6 16:56:50 1986
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       id AA13445; Mon, 6 Jan 86 16:48:07 EST
Date: Mon, 6 Jan 86 16:48:07 EST
Posted-Date: Mon, 6 Jan 86 16:48:07 EST
Received-Date: Mon, 6 Jan 86 16:48:07 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
From: ihnp4!utzoo!henry
Received: by ihnp4.ATT.UUCP id AA29432; 6 Jan 86 14:31:07 CST (Mon)
To: ihnp4!clyde!gatech!usenet-II
Subject: area moderation
References: <[email protected]>
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 46

In response to Lauren's plea for more discussion of non-technical issues,
here's a notion that cropped up here a long time ago:  multiple moderators
for a newsgroup.  This came up during speculation on what would happen if
Usenet kicked the bucket.  One thought offered was that a new network might
grow up in which an article could not go beyond a certain geographic area --
say the local calling region -- without being "blessed" by a local guru.
We called this "area moderation".  The idea was that chit-chat on local
circuits is all very well, but Long Distance bills should be paid only for
things that are certified to be worthy.

Area moderation doesn't work as well as central moderation when it comes
to eliminating duplicates, but it does fulfill many of the other functions
of moderation, notably trash elimination.  Furthermore, it doesn't require
shipping things Long Distance to get them to the moderator, and it doesn't
put all the load for a busy group on one person.

Comments?

                               Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
                               {allegra,ihnp4,linus,decvax}!utzoo!henry



From akgua!ihnp4!utzoo!henry  Mon Jan  6 17:00:24 1986
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       id AA13447; Mon, 6 Jan 86 16:48:35 EST
Date: Mon, 6 Jan 86 16:48:35 EST
Posted-Date: Mon, 6 Jan 86 16:48:35 EST
Received-Date: Mon, 6 Jan 86 16:48:35 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
From: ihnp4!utzoo!henry
Received: by ihnp4.ATT.UUCP id AA29448; 6 Jan 86 14:31:20 CST (Mon)
To: ihnp4!clyde!gatech!usenet-II
Subject: assistant moderators
References: <[email protected]>
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 47

Another idea thrown up by contemplation of moderation problems:  assistant
moderators.  One problem with classical moderation is that when the moderator
goes on vacation, everything stops.  Consider a scheme wherein a group has
several moderators, with one being designated "primary" at any given time,
and the others "secondary".  Traffic is submitted to any of them; in fact
the outside world need not know who's primary moderator at any particular
time.  Secondary moderators filter trash but forward worthy articles to the
primary moderator rather than posting them.  In other words, they function
as "assistant editors" or "readers", while the primary moderator functions
as a chief editor:  there is still one person putting together the final
output, and maintaining its coherence and non-redundancy, but the other
functions are decentralized.  When the person who is currently primary
moderator goes on vacation, one of the secondaries becomes primary, for
the duration at least.  Primariness could rotate, to give tired people a
rest and to give everybody a turn at the top spot.

This spreads out the load, reduces Long-Distance traffic, and provides
better continuity when moderators leave temporarily or permanently.

Comments?

                               Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
                               {allegra,ihnp4,linus,decvax}!utzoo!henry



From seismo!vortex!lauren  Tue Jan  7 18:05:35 1986
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Date: Tue, 7-Jan-86 10:58:33 PST
From: seismo!vortex!lauren (Lauren Weinstein)
Subject: Re: more misc. (long)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: vortex!elsie!ado
Cc: vortex!gatech!usenet-II
In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 6 Jan 86 10:31:18 EST
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 48

Actually, I've looked into 900 numbers for various applications.
They are not practical for data systems in their current forms, and
require VERY high call volumes to break even.  800 numbers, on the
other hand, can be controlled on a call pickup basis.  Also, there
are always OUTGOING WATS (and similar) services as well.

--Lauren--


From seismo!vortex!lauren  Tue Jan  7 18:09:31 1986
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Date: Tue, 7-Jan-86 11:46:09 PST
From: seismo!vortex!lauren (Lauren Weinstein)
Subject: moderators
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: vortex!gatech!usenet-II
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 49

I can see a variety of logistical problems with "geographic" moderators,
but the idea of "assistant" moderators is one I've always assumed would
be used to some extent.  It wouldn't be practical to have only one
person TOTALLY responsible for entire groups--there should always be
backups and perhaps a rotating "primary" moderator for each topic.
In fact, this rotating moderator idea is pretty much the way a number
of ARPANET digests work currently.

--Lauren--


From spaf  Fri Jan 17 14:25:10 1986
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       id AA01687; Fri, 17 Jan 86 14:20:46 EST
Date: Fri, 17 Jan 86 14:20:46 EST
From: Gene Spafford <spaf>
Posted-Date: Fri, 17 Jan 86 14:20:46 EST
Received-Date: Fri, 17 Jan 86 14:20:46 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: usenet-II
Status: O
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X-UID: 50

[Ken Arnold asked me to post this for him. --EHS]

Here's a bio and a few comments.

I come at this from a reader's viewpoint.  I am one of the old timers,
here since nearly the beginning (I was involved in the naming debate,
for example).  I am more personally motivated by user interface issues
(include signal-noise) than by overhead issues, but I promise not to
keep my nose out of any aspect of this discussion.  I also have a
background in organizational development, structural and interpersonal
politics, and other human organization issues.

A few thoughts:

(1) Hobby groups are important.  They give me a reason to care about
reading news.  If they weren't there, I probably would read much less
news.  I make this self-enforcing by putting the technical groups
before the non-technical ones, so that to get to the goodies I have to
eat my vegetables.  But even before this was possible, net.games and
other groups kept me interested.

Another point is that one's work space should not be entirely
functional, but should have human and personal touches.  An office with
no personal touches, like posters, toys, plants, or whatever, is not a
very nice place to work.  If usenet-II is going to be part of my
working environment, I will want that kind of humanity to be
incorperated, and one aspect of that is being able to talk about Lake
Woebegon and Dr. Who.

I say this up front and a little at length because I don't want it to
be lost sight of.  The humanity and personallity of the net is what
makes it attractive to many.  Hobby groups, and to a lesser extent
soapbox groups, are actually vital to the net.  I know some sites who
are on the net because the technical people wanted net.games or
whatever, and they convinced their bosses that they needed
net.unix-wizards.  Whatever our "charter" turns out to be, it should
include non-technical groups.

(2) Keyword based systems

I think this term is being used very loosely by some and very tightly
by others.  People with library information background are very correct
to say that keywords make a poor model for this kind of system.
However, what would be very useful is to be able to create express
exclusion/inclusion more powerfully than currently possible.  In
general, I should be able to use general logical expressions on groups
so I can read only articles on religious philosophy (net.religion.* &
net.philosophy) ignore all things discussion abortion even if they are
cross posted to groups I read (!net.abortion), etc.  This would, I
think, encompass most of the control desired by keyword supporters.
(In fact, the sneaky will notice that this is a keyword based system
with an enforced library, but they will also notice that the only
difference from now is a greater flexibility about the use of keywords
by the *reader* to weed out undersireable articles (and I complained
about other people using "keyword" loosely!).)

(3) Group creation should not be done by collection of votes from the
masses.  (Note that, if we do a keyword based system, with officially
sanctioned keywords, or any other enforced method of message grouping,
this applies to such a system as well).  Any idiot can vote because
something sounds neat.  Then again, group creation should not be done
by collection of votes from net administrators, since they are likely
to more conservative about interesting experiments that maybe ought to
be tried, and besides, they may not be very representative of their
sites.  Obviously the only conclusion is that group creation should not
be done.  Since this is probably not what we want, what could be done?
I would suppose that there ought to be a couple of avenues of
approach.

(4) Moderation is the most misunderstood thing in usenet right now.  It
means censorship to some and relief from trash for others.  If there
are going to be moderators for groups, we must clearly define what that
means.  In fact, for political reason we may need to come up with a new
name (facilitator might be nice) so that people don't dump "moderator"
misunderstandings on the new structure.  We should clearly define what
a "facilitator" (or whatever) would do and would not do, and come up
with some way to publicly complain if someone is abused.  This keeps
people from thinking they can be muzzled, and the facilitator from
thinking they can muzzle effectively, so it is a good brake all
around.  I would think that most, if not all, groups could be
effectively "facilitated".

Well, that sounds like enough verbiage for an introduction.  Comments
are welcome, of course.

               Ken Arnold


From reid@[email protected]  Tue Jan 21 03:10:00 1986
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       id AA11852; Tue, 21 Jan 86 03:02:32 EST
Posted-Date: 18 Jan 1986 2008-PST (Saturday)
Received-Date: Tue, 21 Jan 86 03:02:32 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
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Received: by glacier with Sendmail; Sat, 18 Jan 86 20:08:05 pst
Date: 18 Jan 1986 2008-PST (Saturday)
From: Brian Reid <reid@[email protected]>
Subject: Usenet inc?
To: [email protected]
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 51


I recently had a bad experience with mod.recipes; see net.news for a brief
explanation of the problem. Some guy at LucasFilm ran off with the whole
shooting match, removed all traces of USENET from it, and is busily convincing
people at Usenix that they should take my USENET cookbook, which he has
renamed the "Unix Cook's Manual", and publish it as a for-profit item.

I like Larry Wall's disclaimer in rn very much ("you can do whatever you want
with this as long as you don't try to make a profit or pretend you wrote it.")
Unfortunately, that has no legal meaning, and its presence in the code for rn
does not legally obligate anyone, as far as I know.

I would really like to be able to copyright mod.recipes contents, in
order that people don't try to make a buck off it. I'm eager to have it
distributed free to everyone, and I don't want to use the copyright to
control what any individual does with it, but I am very eager to find a
way to prevent theft and blatant commercialization, and my lawyer
friends tell me that only copyright will have any effect at all.

But I don't want to hold the copyright myself. That would look wrong.
People would think I was trying to build an empire or something. I
would love to be able to say "Copyright (C) 1986, USENET USA" or
"Copyright (C) 1986 Stargate USA Inc." or something like that. I can
probably finesse it for the moment by putting "Copyright (C) 1986 Trust
for Public Recipes", and then paying $20 to register that name with the
California corporation commission and the Santa Clara County court.
I've done that before in other arenas.

Anybody have any ideas? Does anybody disagree with me that the
commercialization of mod.recipes contents after changing it to disguise its
origins is wrong?

Brian

From cbosgd!cbpavo.cbosgd.ATT.UUCP!mark  Sun Feb 23 19:43:48 1986
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Date: Sun, 23 Feb 86 12:58:11 est
From: [email protected] (Mark Horton)
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: Stargate working group formed
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 52

I thought I ought to let you folks know what is happening.
We held a meeting at Uniforum to get this project moving.
While many people showed up (it was advertised as a BOF)
we discussed some issues, got some opinions, and formed a
small working group to get things going.  This group is
currently working on issues such as the charter and business plan.
We're trying to move quickly, since our three sponsoring organizations
(/usr/group, Usenix, and SSS) need to see results quickly.

Obviously a small group can get things done faster than a
50 person group like usenet-II.  But I don't want to exclude
you folks either.  You have a right to be heard, at the very
least.

I sent mail to this list before Uniforum asking if anybody on
this list wanted to be involved in this group.  I didn't get
any responses.  However, if a couple of you are seriously interested
in being one of the few shakers and movers that want to get this
off the ground, and are willing to put some time in to get Stargate
(or whatever this turns into) off the ground, please let me know,
and I'll see what I can do to get you involved.

The working group currently consists of:

       [email protected] (Mark Horton)
       [email protected] (Lauren Weinstein)
       [email protected] (Bruce Weiner)
       [email protected] (Charlie Pilzer)
       [email protected] (Robert Bonomi)
       [email protected] (Eldon Brown)
       [email protected] (Steven List)

If anyone has comments they would like the group to see, you can
send them to me and I'll be happy to forward them to the group.

       Mark

From HERBIE%[email protected]  Sat Mar 22 00:55:09 1986
Received: from CSNet-Relay.CSNET by gatech.GTNET with PMDF (4.30GT/6.3.GT)
       id AA02490; Sat, 22 Mar 86 00:50:39 EST
Posted-Date: 21 Mar 1986 16:52:29-EST (Friday)
Received-Date: Sat, 22 Mar 86 00:50:39 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
Received: from wiscvm.wisc.edu by CSNET-RELAY.ARPA id a011940;
         21 Mar 86 18:04 EST
Received: from (HERBIE)YKTVMH.BITNET by WISCVM.WISC.EDU on 03/21/86 at
 16:02:45 CST
Date: 21 Mar 1986 16:52:29-EST (Friday)
From: "Herbert A. Chong" <HERBIE%[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: more detailed breakdowns of posting activity
Received: from CSNet-Relay by Gatech; 21 Mar 86 20:44:38-EST (Fri)
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 53

in the following charts, the column labelled FREQ indicates the
number of two week sumaries in the data produced by Rick Adams
in which the (group,site,user) had non-zero postings.

Herb Chong...
--------
1              Summary statistics of two week data samples              1
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            15:46 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986

VARIABLE        N         SUM          MEAN       STANDARD       MINIMUM
                                                  DEVIATION       VALUE

FILES        4491  188092.00000   41.88198619   60.15282218   1.00000000
BYTES        4491  243637.92200   54.25026097  111.55703214   0.00000000

VARIABLE        MAXIMUM       SKEWNESS       KURTOSIS
                 VALUE

FILES      487.00000000     2.79627706     9.73190078
BYTES     2099.34800000     6.64019633    73.00748714

1           Newsgroup rankings by total number of files posted          2
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            15:46 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986

                           BAR CHART OF SUMS

NAME                                                   FREQ   FILES SUM
                   |
net.politics       |***********************************  26    7043.000
net.flame          |********************************     26    6366.000
net.sf-lovers      |*****************************        26    5701.000
net.music          |****************************         26    5538.000
net.jokes          |****************************         26    5519.000
net.unix-wizards   |***************************          26    5477.000
net.singles        |*************************            26    4999.000
net.women          |**********************               26    4440.000
net.religion       |*********************                26    4245.000
net.micro          |*********************                26    4166.000
net.auto           |********************                 26    4089.000
net.lang.c         |********************                 26    3971.000
net.movies         |******************                   26    3531.000
net.unix           |*****************                    26    3481.000
net.micro.mac      |*****************                    24    3337.000
net.micro.pc       |****************                     26    3172.000
net.audio          |***************                      26    3038.000
net.wanted         |**************                       26    2812.000
net.startrek       |************                         26    2439.000
net.cooks          |************                         26    2300.000
net.misc           |***********                          26    2209.000
net.consumers      |***********                          26    2154.000
net.origins        |***********                          26    2141.000
net.news.group     |**********                           26    2020.000
net.religion.jew   |**********                           26    1942.000
net.philosophy     |*********                            26    1850.000
net.sources        |*********                            26    1808.000
net.micro.cpm      |*********                            26    1775.000
net.abortion       |*********                            26    1752.000
net.news           |*********                            26    1717.000
net.nlang          |********                             26    1698.000
net.physics        |********                             26    1656.000
net.kids           |********                             26    1631.000
net.tv             |********                             26    1569.000
net.ham-radio      |********                             26    1554.000
net.religion.chr   |********                             23    1544.000
net.bizarre        |********                              6    1525.000
net.books          |********                             26    1510.000
net.med            |********                             26    1506.000
net.wanted.sourc   |*******                              26    1479.000
net.legal          |*******                              26    1453.000
net.politics.the   |*******                              20    1431.000
net.arch           |*******                              26    1426.000
net.followup       |*******                              26    1350.000
net.sport.baseba   |*******                              26    1320.000
net.space          |******                               26    1280.000
net.comics         |******                               26    1216.000
net.motss          |******                               26    1179.000
net.micro.atari    |******                               26    1166.000
net.aviation       |******                               26    1135.000
net.games.hack     |******                               20    1125.000
net.games.frp      |*****                                26    1098.000
                   -----+----+----+----+----+----+----+
                      1000 2000 3000 4000 5000 6000 7000

                                 FILES SUM
1          Newsgroup rankings by total number of Kbytes posted          3
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            15:46 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986

                           BAR CHART OF SUMS

    NAME                                           FREQ   BYTES SUM
                       |
    net.sources        |***************************  26    20495.15
    net.politics       |***************              26    11344.61
    net.sources.mac    |***************              20    10988.33
    net.religion       |*************                26     9553.42
    net.flame          |*********                    26     7022.06
    net.women          |*********                    26     6377.22
    net.singles        |********                     26     5993.14
    net.origins        |*******                      26     5553.11
    net.micro.mac      |*******                      24     5001.05
    net.unix-wizards   |******                       26     4765.56
    net.sf-lovers      |******                       26     4700.30
    net.music          |******                       26     4633.09
    net.philosophy     |******                       26     4250.41
    net.movies         |*****                        26     3980.43
    net.jokes          |*****                        26     3767.16
    net.micro          |*****                        26     3698.71
    net.lang.c         |*****                        26     3623.82
    net.abortion       |*****                        26     3611.37
    net.auto           |*****                        26     3573.61
    net.religion.chr   |*****                        23     3508.10
    net.sources.game   |*****                        18     3472.14
    net.micro.pc       |*****                        26     3420.70
    net.audio          |****                         26     3332.50
    net.religion.jew   |****                         26     3215.24
    net.unix           |****                         26     3028.02
    net.politics.the   |****                         20     2926.83
    net.news.group     |***                          26     2302.87
    net.news           |***                          26     2206.99
    net.misc           |***                          26     2165.68
    net.cooks          |***                          26     2053.38
    net.games.frp      |***                          26     2015.38
    net.arch           |***                          26     2011.88
    net.startrek       |***                          26     2008.76
    net.consumers      |***                          26     1936.72
    net.kids           |**                           26     1773.67
    net.ham-radio      |**                           26     1767.99
    net.books          |**                           26     1737.78
    net.physics        |**                           26     1692.42
    net.wanted         |**                           26     1689.99
    net.nlang          |**                           26     1684.97
    net.legal          |**                           26     1660.95
    net.motss          |**                           26     1638.61
    net.comics         |**                           26     1566.08
    net.micro.atari    |**                           26     1409.15
    net.med            |**                           26     1386.53
    net.bizarre        |**                            6     1376.35
    net.mail           |**                           26     1347.77
    net.tv             |**                           26     1334.22
    net.followup       |**                           26     1299.98
    net.sources.bugs   |**                           26     1204.96
    net.tv.drwho       |**                           26     1195.40
    net.sport.baseba   |**                           26     1160.15
                       --------+-------+-------+---
                             6000    12000   18000

                                 BYTES SUM
1              Summary statistics of two week data samples              1
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            15:45 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986

VARIABLE        N         SUM          MEAN       STANDARD       MINIMUM
                                                  DEVIATION       VALUE

FILES        5673  101052.00000   17.81279746   12.65935930   4.00000000
BYTES        5673  162406.56100   28.62798537   40.86246703   0.00000000

VARIABLE        MAXIMUM       SKEWNESS       KURTOSIS
                 VALUE

FILES      135.00000000     2.50465753     9.89846670
BYTES      700.56600000     6.90766050    76.61609816

1             Site rankings by total number of files posted             2
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            15:45 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986

                           BAR CHART OF SUMS

    NAME                                            FREQ   FILES SUM
                       |
    acf4.UUCP          |****************************  27    1381.000
    ucbvax.ARPA        |***************************   26    1333.000
    pyuxd.UUCP         |**************************    26    1318.000
    ucla-cs.UUCP       |*************************     26    1267.000
    fluke.UUCP         |*************************     27    1227.000
    umcp-cs.UUCP       |************************      27    1199.000
    drutx.UUCP         |*********************         27    1026.000
    utastro.UUCP       |********************          26    1005.000
    utzoo.UUCP         |********************          27     998.000
    nsc.UUCP           |********************          26     994.000
    uwmacc.UUCP        |*******************           27     956.000
    alice.UUCP         |******************            25     883.000
    sun.uucp           |******************            27     877.000
    reed.UUCP          |*****************             25     834.000
    amdahl.UUCP        |****************              27     821.000
    dartvax.UUCP       |****************              27     786.000
    rochester.UUCP     |***************               27     732.000
    inmet.UUCP         |**************                23     721.000
    harvard.ARPA       |**************                27     716.000
    ssc-vax.UUCP       |**************                27     715.000
    watdcsu.UUCP       |**************                26     711.000
    brl-tgr.ARPA       |**************                27     703.000
    ukma.UUCP          |**************                25     699.000
    watmath.UUCP       |**************                27     698.000
    ut-sally.UUCP      |**************                27     694.000
    ihlpg.UUCP         |**************                20     689.000
    unc.UUCP           |*************                 23     669.000
    sdcrdcf.UUCP       |*************                 27     649.000
    mit-eddie.UUCP     |************                  26     620.000
    sphinx.UChicago.   |************                  20     599.000
    ecsvax.UUCP        |************                  27     593.000
    aecom.UUCP         |************                  25     592.000
    ttidcc.UUCP        |***********                   23     570.000
    cbosgd.UUCP        |***********                   24     570.000
    sjuvax.UUCP        |***********                   20     566.000
    gitpyr.UUCP        |***********                   25     559.000
    mhuxt.UUCP         |***********                   27     553.000
    amdcad.UUCP        |***********                   24     534.000
    topaz.ARPA         |**********                    16     524.000
    psivax.UUCP        |**********                    24     519.000
    hound.UUCP         |**********                    25     510.000
    sunybcs.UUCP       |**********                    24     501.000
    peora.UUCP         |**********                    16     499.000
    ames.UUCP          |**********                    24     493.000
    hao.UUCP           |*********                     26     472.000
    mgweed.UUCP        |*********                     25     455.000
    spar.UUCP          |*********                     21     454.000
    ut-ngp.UUCP        |*********                     18     450.000
    cvl.UUCP           |*********                     19     432.000
    vortex.UUCP        |*********                     26     430.000
    abnji.UUCP         |********                      21     419.000
    fortune.UUCP       |********                      24     416.000
                       --------+-------+-------+----
                              400     800    1200
1             Site rankings by total number of Kbytes posted            3
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            15:45 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986

                           BAR CHART OF SUMS

        NAME                                   FREQ   BYTES SUM
                           |
        pyuxd.UUCP         |*******************  26    3814.034
        ucbvax.ARPA        |**************       26    2774.167
        drutx.UUCP         |*************        27    2599.707
        umcp-cs.UUCP       |************         27    2448.573
        cmu-cs-spice.ARP   |***********          12    2293.461
        ucla-cs.UUCP       |***********          26    2161.474
        fluke.UUCP         |***********          27    2106.222
        nsc.UUCP           |**********           26    2067.389
        harvard.ARPA       |*********            27    1821.455
        uwmacc.UUCP        |*********            27    1782.407
        utastro.UUCP       |*********            26    1760.658
        sphinx.UChicago.   |********             20    1584.432
        dartvax.UUCP       |********             27    1522.710
        inmet.UUCP         |*******              23    1491.984
        sdcc3.UUCP         |*******              19    1424.383
        acf4.UUCP          |*******              27    1415.753
        reed.UUCP          |*******              25    1396.660
        utzoo.UUCP         |*******              27    1325.565
        sun.uucp           |*******              27    1315.247
        mcvax.UUCP         |******               19    1240.917
        watdcsu.UUCP       |******               26    1217.500
        ssc-vax.UUCP       |******               27    1174.966
        ut-sally.UUCP      |******               27    1152.171
        brl-tgr.ARPA       |*****                27    1086.042
        amdahl.UUCP        |*****                27    1069.365
        watmath.UUCP       |*****                27    1060.882
        sdcrdcf.UUCP       |*****                27    1038.121
        rochester.UUCP     |*****                27    1010.096
        cbscc.UUCP         |*****                21    1009.087
        topaz.ARPA         |*****                16     993.811
        ukma.UUCP          |*****                25     992.813
        ttidcc.UUCP        |*****                23     972.154
        gitpyr.UUCP        |*****                25     939.720
        hao.UUCP           |*****                26     939.639
        cvl.UUCP           |*****                19     939.008
        ihlpg.UUCP         |*****                20     907.056
        ames.UUCP          |****                 24     890.494
        unc.UUCP           |****                 23     888.217
        spar.UUCP          |****                 21     886.107
        lanl.ARPA          |****                 13     880.377
        alice.UUCP         |****                 25     880.074
        aecom.UUCP         |****                 25     844.495
        wanginst.UUCP      |****                 13     838.357
        psivax.UUCP        |****                 24     826.278
        cybvax0.UUCP       |****                 25     818.076
        cmu-cs-k.ARPA      |****                 18     761.744
        whuxl.UUCP         |****                 20     760.942
        peora.UUCP         |****                 16     743.733
        nlm-vax.ARPA       |****                  4     742.267
        cbosgd.UUCP        |****                 24     735.236
        mit-eddie.UUCP     |****                 26     726.122
        sjuvax.UUCP        |****                 20     706.749
                           -----+----+----+----
                              1000 2000 3000
1              Summary statistics of two week data samples              1
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            15:45 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986

VARIABLE        N         SUM          MEAN       STANDARD       MINIMUM
                                                  DEVIATION       VALUE

FILES       14077   93403.00000    6.63514953    6.08096439   3.00000000
BYTES       14077  152127.00000   10.80677701   24.96109851   0.00000000

VARIABLE        MAXIMUM       SKEWNESS       KURTOSIS
                 VALUE

FILES      135.00000000     5.26688366    56.90391347
BYTES      700.00000000    11.69303486   217.91933864

1             User rankings by total number of files posted             2
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            15:45 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986

                           BAR CHART OF SUMS

     NAME                                          FREQ   FILES SUM
                        |
     [email protected]     |**************************  27    1296.000
     [email protected]   |**************              28     705.000
     [email protected]    |**************              27     703.000
     [email protected]   |************                28     584.000
     [email protected]   |***********                 28     525.000
     [email protected]   |*********                   26     471.000
     wmartin@brl-tgr.   |*********                   28     467.000
     [email protected]   |********                    28     413.000
     [email protected]   |********                    23     405.000
     [email protected]   |********                     8     398.000
     [email protected]     |********                    16     377.000
     [email protected]   |*******                     26     352.000
     [email protected]   |*******                     27     343.000
     [email protected]     |*******                     19     336.000
     [email protected]     |*******                     23     335.000
     [email protected]   |*******                     19     330.000
     [email protected]       |*******                     14     329.000
     [email protected]      |******                      24     321.000
     [email protected]    |******                      24     318.000
     [email protected]   |******                      22     313.000
     [email protected]      |******                      19     311.000
     [email protected]   |******                      18     307.000
     [email protected]     |******                      23     301.000
     [email protected]    |******                      25     301.000
     hollombe@ttidcc.   |******                      23     301.000
     [email protected]   |******                      26     301.000
     [email protected]    |******                      20     295.000
     [email protected]   |******                      23     290.000
     [email protected]    |*****                       14     273.000
     [email protected]    |*****                       27     262.000
     [email protected]   |*****                       20     262.000
     [email protected]     |*****                       22     257.000
     [email protected]   |*****                       21     252.000
     [email protected]   |*****                       10     251.000
     [email protected]   |*****                       25     245.000
     [email protected]     |*****                       23     245.000
     [email protected]   |*****                       17     230.000
     [email protected]   |*****                       19     230.000
     [email protected]   |*****                       24     227.000
     [email protected]    |****                        20     223.000
     [email protected]    |****                        23     220.000
     [email protected]     |****                        20     217.000
     [email protected]   |****                        14     217.000
     [email protected]   |****                         5     216.000
     [email protected]   |****                        17     212.000
     [email protected]   |****                        17     212.000
     [email protected]   |****                        23     211.000
     [email protected]   |****                         4     206.000
     [email protected]     |****                        14     202.000
     [email protected]   |****                         9     202.000
     [email protected]   |****                        15     200.000
     [email protected]     |****                        24     198.000
                        --------+-------+-------+--
                               400     800    1200

                                 FILES SUM
1             User rankings by total number of files posted             3
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            15:45 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986

                           BAR CHART OF SUMS

        NAME                                   FREQ   BYTES SUM
                           |
        [email protected]     |*******************  27    3779.000
        tdn@cmu-cs-spice   |********             14    1674.000
        [email protected]    |*******              27    1489.000
        [email protected]   |******               28    1179.000
        [email protected]     |******                9    1160.000
        [email protected]   |*****                26     990.000
        [email protected]   |*****                28     912.000
        [email protected]   |*****                26     910.000
        [email protected]     |****                 20     872.000
        [email protected]   |****                  9     861.000
        [email protected]   |****                 27     759.000
        [email protected]    |****                  4     745.000
        [email protected]   |****                  7     735.000
        [email protected]     |****                 15     730.000
        [email protected]   |****                 25     724.000
        [email protected]     |****                 23     720.000
        [email protected]   |****                 23     704.000
        [email protected]   |***                  28     685.000
        [email protected]   |***                   1     682.000
        [email protected]   |***                   3     662.000
        [email protected]   |***                  17     654.000
        [email protected]     |***                  16     612.000
        wmartin@brl-tgr.   |***                  28     594.000
        [email protected]    |***                  20     594.000
        [email protected]   |***                  17     581.000
        [email protected]       |***                  14     580.000
        [email protected]      |***                  15     577.000
        [email protected]     |***                   7     565.000
        [email protected]    |***                  23     563.000
        [email protected]   |***                   2     560.000
        [email protected]    |***                   4     549.000
        carnes@gargoyle.   |***                  23     546.000
        [email protected]   |***                   2     530.000
        [email protected]   |***                  22     525.000
        [email protected]   |***                  22     524.000
        [email protected]   |***                  26     501.000
        [email protected]       |***                   5     500.000
        hua@cmu-cs-edu1.   |**                    7     491.000
        hollombe@ttidcc.   |**                   23     490.000
        [email protected]   |**                   15     480.000
        [email protected]      |**                   24     474.000
        [email protected]   |**                   28     465.000
        [email protected]   |**                    2     460.000
        [email protected]   |**                    2     454.000
        [email protected]   |**                    7     453.000
        [email protected]   |**                    7     450.000
        [email protected]   |**                    8     445.000
        [email protected]       |**                   16     440.000
        [email protected]   |**                   22     439.000
        [email protected]   |**                    7     439.000
        [email protected]       |**                    5     433.000
        [email protected]   |**                   21     433.000
                           -----+----+----+----
                              1000 2000 3000

                                 BYTES SUM

From HERBIE%[email protected]  Sat Mar 22 00:54:23 1986
Received: from CSNet-Relay.CSNET by gatech.GTNET with PMDF (4.30GT/6.3.GT)
       id AA02456; Sat, 22 Mar 86 00:48:55 EST
Posted-Date: 21 Mar 1986 11:28:23-EST (Friday)
Received-Date: Sat, 22 Mar 86 00:48:55 EST
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Received: from 3000402700 by CSNET-RELAY.ARPA id a008123; 21 Mar 86 11:34 EST
Received: from (HERBIE)YKTVMH.BITNET by WISCVM.WISC.EDU on 03/21/86 at
 10:30:00 CST
Date: 21 Mar 1986 11:28:23-EST (Friday)
From: "Herbert A. Chong" <HERBIE%[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: here and there, this and that
Received: from CSNet-Relay by Gatech; 21 Mar 86 20:42:01-EST (Fri)
Status: O
X-Status:
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X-UID: 54

well,  it's been  nearly  two months  since  i've heard  anything
useful on  this mailing list. it's  a sign of the  times i guess.
with all  the ambition on the  net, not wonder it's  going all to
pot. i'm  not blameless on this  matter as i've got  a few things
that  i intended  to do  that i've  just got  around to.  a while
back,  i asked  Rick  Adams at  seismo to  send  me his  biweekly
summary data for analysis. well,  i finally worked up enough free
time  to transform  it into  something i  could use  and do  some
analyses. this  is a  very short description  of what  i've found
and a more detailed analysis will follow at a later date.

the data that Rick sent me is the data that the biweekly postings
from seismo  are extracted  from. what i  have covers  the period
October 23/84 to  November 8/85. in a little over  a year we find
that

1)  4013 different  users  ([email protected] combination)  posted
93,403  articles  that  reached  seismo with  152,127  Kbytes  of
article  body  and headers.  estimated  cost  of transmission  to
seismo using  Rick's posted figures  in mod.newslists using  1K =
1000 bytes was $3,803.18.

2) 101,052  articles originated from 776  different sites reached
seismo  and  totalled  162,406.561   Kbytes.  estimated  cost  of
transmission was $4060.16.

3)  232  newsgroups had  activity  with  188,092 articles  posted
totalling 243,637.922 Kbytes.  estimated cost was $6090.95.

4)  the  average user  posted  6.6351  articles every  two  weeks
totalling 10.80 Kbytes including headers

5) the average  site originated 18.8127 articles  every two weeks
and totalled 28.63 Kbytes including headers

6) the average  newsgroup had 41.8820 news articles  posted to it
every two weeks with a total article size of 54.25 Kbytes

7) the  most prolific poster in  terms of files as  well as bytes
posted  was  Rich  Rosen  (no surprises  here)  with  1296  files
totalling 3779 Kbytes. this works out  to 48 files and 140 Kbytes
every two  weeks. this  accounted for 1.39%  of all  files posted
and  2.48% of  all Kbytes  posted. surprise  of surprises,  Henry
Spencer was next in terms of  articles posted with 705 and Chuqui
was third with  703. 4th and following are below  600 articles in
the time  period. number 4 was  Jeff Meyer, 5 was  Chris Torek, 6
was Charley Wingate, 7 was Will Martin, 8 was Lauren Weinstein, 9
was Sarima, and  10 was someone at acf4.UUCP. in  terms of bytes,
somebody named [email protected] was  second with 1674 Kbytes
and the rest trailed far behind  after that. Rich Rosen was about
2.26 times as prolific as the next closest person but i hear that
his  articles  consisted  mostly  of quotes  from  other  people.
nothing like originality.  i wonder if it was  coincidence that 2
of the top  3 posters are on  this mailing list and 6  of the top
10. for what it's worth, i was  20 in articles with 313 and 48 in
bytes posted.

8)  the top  10 posters  by articles  posted accounted  for 5,967
articles or 6.3844% of the total articles and the top 10 by bytes
posted  accounted  for 13,826  Kbytes  or  9.0885% of  the  total
volume. 5 people  were in the top 10 using  the both the criteria
of number  of articles  posted and number  of bytes  posted: Rich
Rosen, Chuqui, Jeff Meyer, Chris Torek, and Charlie Wingate.

9) the most  prolific site was acf4.UUCP, wherever  that is, with
1318 articles  during the  measurement period  or 1.3666%  of the
total number of  articles posted. i was surprised  to find ucbvax
next.  was  it  because  the data  collection  software  did  not
distinguish  between  the fa  and  mod  newsgroups gated  through
ucbvax? pyuxd, Rich  Rosen's home machine, was 3, and  so on down
the line.  the thing  i notice  here is that  the list  is highly
correlated to  the top  10 individual posters  list. to  me, this
indicates that on these machines anyways the posting is dominated
by one  person. i can't  tell if  these are personal  netnodes or
not but it sure seemed that  way as far as netnews was concerned.
watdcsu,  my home  machine at  the  time, ranked  21 in  articles
posted.  i did my share.

10) in  terms of bytes  posted, pyuxd.UUCP (Rich's place)  was #1
with 3814.03 Kbytes, ahead of  ucbvax with 2774.17 and drutx.UUCP
with  2599.71.   (wasn't  drutx  Ken  Arndt's   machine?)  if  my
interpretation of  ucbvax's place correctly, Rich  Rosen produced
more  bytes  of articles  than  all  the  fa and  mod  newsgroups
forwarded  through ucbvax.  the top  10 sites  produced 23,868.88
Kbytes of news articles which was 14.697% of total Kbytes posted.

11) the most active newsgroup in  terms of number of articles was
net.politics  with   7043,  followed  by  net.flame   with  6366,
net.sf-lovers  with 5701,  net.music had  5538, and  so on  down.
net.politics accounted  for 3.7444%  of all articles  posted. the
top 10 newsgroups totalled 53,494  articles posted or 28.4403% of
all articles  posted. of the top  10, only 2 could  be considered
technical, net.unix-wizards and net.micro.  since i read both, an
observation i  have is  that whoever makes  the TU-81  tape drive
must be making a killing since  i see so many articles asking for
device drivers  for it.  the atari  520st and  the amiga  hit the
markets at the  time so there were a whole  flood of things there
too.

12) in terms of number of bytes posted, net.sources is first with
20,495.1 Kbytes or  8.4121% of the total. no  big surprises here.
next was net.politics with 11344.6, net.sources.mac with 10988.3,
net.religion with 9553.4,  and net.flame with 6377.2.  the top 10
had a  total traffic of 87,093  Kbytes or 35.7471% of  the total.
of   the  top   10   by   bytes,  net.sources,   net.sources.mac,
net.micro.mac,  and   net.unix-wizards  could  be   construed  as
technical.

conclusions:

1) the top  25 posters out of  4013 account for about  10% of all
traffic.

2) the top 25 sites of 776 account for about 20% of all traffic.

3) the top 25 newsgroups out of  232 account for more than 40% of
all traffic.

4) the  net is mostly non-technical  in terms of traffic  and any
usenet-II  will  have  to  take this  into  account.  restricting
usenet-II to only technical newsgroups would cut traffic by about
60% to 70%.

5) there are few active users of the net and their sites dominate
the  newsgroups. approximately  1/3 of  the  top 25  are on  this
mailing list.

6) cutting off Rich Rosen wouldn't have helped a lot overall.

Note: Rick, i have no explanation for the wide discrepancy of the
number of articles and bytes posted  between the by user, by site
and by group data you sent me.  any ideas?

Herb Chong...

From HERBIE%[email protected]  Sat Mar 22 01:02:11 1986
Received: from CSNet-Relay.CSNET by gatech.GTNET with PMDF (4.30GT/6.3.GT)
       id AA02456; Sat, 22 Mar 86 00:48:55 EST
Posted-Date: 21 Mar 1986 11:28:23-EST (Friday)
Received-Date: Sat, 22 Mar 86 00:48:55 EST
Message-Id: <[email protected]>
Received: from 3000402700 by CSNET-RELAY.ARPA id a008123; 21 Mar 86 11:34 EST
Received: from (HERBIE)YKTVMH.BITNET by WISCVM.WISC.EDU on 03/21/86 at
 10:30:00 CST
Date: 21 Mar 1986 11:28:23-EST (Friday)
From: "Herbert A. Chong" <HERBIE%[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: here and there, this and that
Received: from CSNet-Relay by Gatech; 21 Mar 86 20:42:01-EST (Fri)
Status: O
X-Status:
X-Keywords:
X-UID: 55

well,  it's been  nearly  two months  since  i've heard  anything
useful on  this mailing list. it's  a sign of the  times i guess.
with all  the ambition on the  net, not wonder it's  going all to
pot. i'm  not blameless on this  matter as i've got  a few things
that  i intended  to do  that i've  just got  around to.  a while
back,  i asked  Rick  Adams at  seismo to  send  me his  biweekly
summary data for analysis. well,  i finally worked up enough free
time  to transform  it into  something i  could use  and do  some
analyses. this  is a  very short description  of what  i've found
and a more detailed analysis will follow at a later date.

the data that Rick sent me is the data that the biweekly postings
from seismo  are extracted  from. what i  have covers  the period
October 23/84 to  November 8/85. in a little over  a year we find
that

1)  4013 different  users  ([email protected] combination)  posted
93,403  articles  that  reached  seismo with  152,127  Kbytes  of
article  body  and headers.  estimated  cost  of transmission  to
seismo using  Rick's posted figures  in mod.newslists using  1K =
1000 bytes was $3,803.18.

2) 101,052  articles originated from 776  different sites reached
seismo  and  totalled  162,406.561   Kbytes.  estimated  cost  of
transmission was $4060.16.

3)  232  newsgroups had  activity  with  188,092 articles  posted
totalling 243,637.922 Kbytes.  estimated cost was $6090.95.

4)  the  average user  posted  6.6351  articles every  two  weeks
totalling 10.80 Kbytes including headers

5) the average  site originated 18.8127 articles  every two weeks
and totalled 28.63 Kbytes including headers

6) the average  newsgroup had 41.8820 news articles  posted to it
every two weeks with a total article size of 54.25 Kbytes

7) the  most prolific poster in  terms of files as  well as bytes
posted  was  Rich  Rosen  (no surprises  here)  with  1296  files
totalling 3779 Kbytes. this works out  to 48 files and 140 Kbytes
every two  weeks. this  accounted for 1.39%  of all  files posted
and  2.48% of  all Kbytes  posted. surprise  of surprises,  Henry
Spencer was next in terms of  articles posted with 705 and Chuqui
was third with  703. 4th and following are below  600 articles in
the time  period. number 4 was  Jeff Meyer, 5 was  Chris Torek, 6
was Charley Wingate, 7 was Will Martin, 8 was Lauren Weinstein, 9
was Sarima, and  10 was someone at acf4.UUCP. in  terms of bytes,
somebody named [email protected] was  second with 1674 Kbytes
and the rest trailed far behind  after that. Rich Rosen was about
2.26 times as prolific as the next closest person but i hear that
his  articles  consisted  mostly  of quotes  from  other  people.
nothing like originality.  i wonder if it was  coincidence that 2
of the top  3 posters are on  this mailing list and 6  of the top
10. for what it's worth, i was  20 in articles with 313 and 48 in
bytes posted.

8)  the top  10 posters  by articles  posted accounted  for 5,967
articles or 6.3844% of the total articles and the top 10 by bytes
posted  accounted  for 13,826  Kbytes  or  9.0885% of  the  total
volume. 5 people  were in the top 10 using  the both the criteria
of number  of articles  posted and number  of bytes  posted: Rich
Rosen, Chuqui, Jeff Meyer, Chris Torek, and Charlie Wingate.

9) the most  prolific site was acf4.UUCP, wherever  that is, with
1318 articles  during the  measurement period  or 1.3666%  of the
total number of  articles posted. i was surprised  to find ucbvax
next.  was  it  because  the data  collection  software  did  not
distinguish  between  the fa  and  mod  newsgroups gated  through
ucbvax? pyuxd, Rich  Rosen's home machine, was 3, and  so on down
the line.  the thing  i notice  here is that  the list  is highly
correlated to  the top  10 individual posters  list. to  me, this
indicates that on these machines anyways the posting is dominated
by one  person. i can't  tell if  these are personal  netnodes or
not but it sure seemed that  way as far as netnews was concerned.
watdcsu,  my home  machine at  the  time, ranked  21 in  articles
posted.  i did my share.

10) in  terms of bytes  posted, pyuxd.UUCP (Rich's place)  was #1
with 3814.03 Kbytes, ahead of  ucbvax with 2774.17 and drutx.UUCP
with  2599.71.   (wasn't  drutx  Ken  Arndt's   machine?)  if  my
interpretation of  ucbvax's place correctly, Rich  Rosen produced
more  bytes  of articles  than  all  the  fa and  mod  newsgroups
forwarded  through ucbvax.  the top  10 sites  produced 23,868.88
Kbytes of news articles which was 14.697% of total Kbytes posted.

11) the most active newsgroup in  terms of number of articles was
net.politics  with   7043,  followed  by  net.flame   with  6366,
net.sf-lovers  with 5701,  net.music had  5538, and  so on  down.
net.politics accounted  for 3.7444%  of all articles  posted. the
top 10 newsgroups totalled 53,494  articles posted or 28.4403% of
all articles  posted. of the top  10, only 2 could  be considered
technical, net.unix-wizards and net.micro.  since i read both, an
observation i  have is  that whoever makes  the TU-81  tape drive
must be making a killing since  i see so many articles asking for
device drivers  for it.  the atari  520st and  the amiga  hit the
markets at the  time so there were a whole  flood of things there
too.

12) in terms of number of bytes posted, net.sources is first with
20,495.1 Kbytes or  8.4121% of the total. no  big surprises here.
next was net.politics with 11344.6, net.sources.mac with 10988.3,
net.religion with 9553.4,  and net.flame with 6377.2.  the top 10
had a  total traffic of 87,093  Kbytes or 35.7471% of  the total.
of   the  top   10   by   bytes,  net.sources,   net.sources.mac,
net.micro.mac,  and   net.unix-wizards  could  be   construed  as
technical.

conclusions:

1) the top  25 posters out of  4013 account for about  10% of all
traffic.

2) the top 25 sites of 776 account for about 20% of all traffic.

3) the top 25 newsgroups out of  232 account for more than 40% of
all traffic.

4) the  net is mostly non-technical  in terms of traffic  and any
usenet-II  will  have  to  take this  into  account.  restricting
usenet-II to only technical newsgroups would cut traffic by about
60% to 70%.

5) there are few active users of the net and their sites dominate
the  newsgroups. approximately  1/3 of  the  top 25  are on  this
mailing list.

6) cutting off Rich Rosen wouldn't have helped a lot overall.

Note: Rick, i have no explanation for the wide discrepancy of the
number of articles and bytes posted  between the by user, by site
and by group data you sent me.  any ideas?

Herb Chong...

From HERBIE%[email protected]  Sat Mar 22 05:41:03 1986
Received: from CSNet-Relay.CSNET by gatech.GTNET with PMDF (4.30GT/6.3.GT)
       id AA04526; Sat, 22 Mar 86 05:30:01 EST
Posted-Date: 21 Mar 1986 16:56:43-EST (Friday)
Received-Date: Sat, 22 Mar 86 05:30:01 EST
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 16:05:38 CST
Date: 21 Mar 1986 16:56:43-EST (Friday)
From: "Herbert A. Chong" <HERBIE%[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: time plots of activities
Received: from CSNet-Relay by Gatech; 22 Mar 86 4:50:16-EST (Sat)
Status: O
X-Status:
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the postings by the top 10 newsgroups, 10 sites, 25 users follow.

Herb Chong...
--------
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups            1
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=net.flame

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
      |
550   +
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |                 A
450   +
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |                                 A
      |                                         A
      |                                       A
350   +
      |
      |
      |                               A           A
300   +                                    A
      |
      |  A                A
      |                     A
250   +
      |         A              A                    A
      |                                                          A A  A
      |            A                A
200   +                           A                          A
      |
      |                                                  A
      |                                                       A
150   +    A  A
      |              A
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |                                                A
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups            2
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=net.flame

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +                 A
      |
      |                                         A
      |
      |
400   +                                 A     A
      |                     A                     A
      |
      |                               A                               A
      |                   A                                        A
300   +  A      A
      |
      |
      |                                    A        A            A
      |            A                A                        A
200   +                        A
      |                                                  A    A
      |    A  A                   A
      |              A
      |
100   +
      |                                                A
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups            3
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=net.jokes

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
      |
550   +
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |                     A
300   +                                    A    A
      |                                 A     A
      |                   A                         A
      |                        A
250   +            A                                     A            A
      |                           A
      |                 A
      |                             A             A
200   +
      |                               A
      |         A
      |       A
150   +                                                A     A     A
      |                                                          A
      |  A           A
      |
100   +    A                                                  A
      |
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups            4
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=net.jokes

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |                     A                   A
200   +                             A         A
      |                               A A  A
      |            A      A                         A    A
      |         A    A         A  A                                   A
      |       A         A                         A              A A
100   +  A                                             A     A
      |    A
      |                                                       A
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups            5
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=net.micro

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
      |
550   +
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |                                                  A
250   +
      |
      |                                    A  A              A
      |
200   +                        A                              A  A A
      |                                 A
      |                           A A           A   A                 A
      |                               A
150   +                   A A                          A
      |                 A
      |       A A
      |            A
100   +
      |                                           A
      |
      |  A A
 50   +              A
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups            6
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=net.micro

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |                                       A
      |
      |                                    A
      |                                                  A
200   +                                         A                A
      |                                 A
      |                           A A                  A     A     A
      |         A              A                    A         A       A
      |                     A
100   +       A    A                  A           A
      |                 A A
      |  A A
      |              A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups            7
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=net.music

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
      |
550   +
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |                                                               A
350   +
      |
      |                                    A
      |
300   +                                             A
      |
      |                             A                              A
      |                                 A
250   +                        A  A   A
      |       A                                          A
      |
      |                     A                                    A
200   +         A         A                       A
      |    A
      |            A
      |                                       A A            A
150   +  A
      |                 A                                     A
      |
      |              A
100   +                                                A
      |
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups            8
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=net.music

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |                                                               A
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |                                             A
      |                                                            A
      |                           A A      A                     A
      |
200   +       A                       A
      |                                           A      A
      |                                 A     A A            A
      |  A      A  A        A  A                              A
      |    A              A
100   +                                                A
      |              A  A
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups            9
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           NAME=net.politics

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
      |
550   +
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |         A
      |
      |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
400   +                 A
      |       A
      |
      |
350   +
      |                   A
      |                     A
      |            A                              A
300   +    A                            A
      |                                       A
      |                                                            A
      |                        A                         A    A
250   +                             A A                          A
      |                                                               A
      |                                         A
      |                                             A        A
200   +              A
      |                           A        A
      |
      |
150   +  A
      |                                                A
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups           10
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           NAME=net.politics

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |         A
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |       A           A
600   +                 A
      |
      |
      |                     A
      |                                           A
500   +            A                          A
      |    A                            A
      |                                                       A    A
      |                                                  A
      |                        A                                 A    A
400   +                             A A
      |                                                      A
      |                                         A
      |
      |
300   +                           A                 A
      |              A
      |  A                                 A
      |
      |                                                A
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups           11
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           NAME=net.religion

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
      |
550   +
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |                           A
350   +
      |                             A
      |
      |       A A
300   +
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |            A
      |
      |
200   +                   A                                      A
      |    A                   A
      |                     A         A                       A
      |
150   +                                       A
      |                                 A                             A
      |                                                            A
      |                                    A    A        A   A
100   +                 A
      |  A
      |
      |              A
 50   +                                             A  A
      |                                           A
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups           12
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           NAME=net.religion

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +                             A
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |                           A
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |       A
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |                               A
      |         A                             A
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |    A                                    A                A
400   +                                                       A
      |
      |                     A
      |            A           A
      |                   A             A                             A
300   +                                    A
      |                                                      A
      |  A
      |                                                  A
      |                                                            A
200   +
      |                                             A
      |                 A
      |
      |
100   +              A                            A    A
      |
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups           13
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           NAME=net.sf-lovers

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
      |
550   +
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
450   +
      |                                             A
      |
      |
400   +
      |                                                  A
      |
      |
350   +                     A
      |
      |
      |
300   +                                           A                   A
      |                                                       A
      |                   A    A                                   A
      |                                 A       A
250   +                                       A
      |                 A                                        A
      |                                    A                 A
      |                                                A
200   +                               A
      |
      |
      |                           A
150   +                             A
      |
      |
      |
100   +            A
      |
      |       A
      |         A    A
 50   +    A
      |  A
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups           14
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           NAME=net.sf-lovers

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +                                                       A
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +                                                  A
      |
      |                                         A A A            A
      |                                       A
      |                                                            A
200   +                     A                          A
      |                                    A                 A        A
      |                        A        A
      |            A      A       A
      |                 A           A A
100   +       A A
      |
      |              A
      |  A A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups           15
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                            NAME=net.singles

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
      |
550   +
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
400   +                                             A
      |
      |
      |
350   +                                                  A
      |
      |
      |                 A
300   +
      |                                         A
      |            A
      |
250   +
      |                                           A
      |                        A  A                          A
      |                   A
200   +                             A   A
      |
      |  A                            A       A        A      A
      |              A
150   +
      |                     A
      |                                    A                       A
      |         A
100   +                                                          A
      |    A                                                          A
      |
      |       A
 50   +
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups           16
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                            NAME=net.singles

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |                                             A    A
      |                 A
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |                                         A
300   +            A
      |                   A                       A
      |                                                A     A
      |  A
      |                           A A
200   +                        A        A
      |              A                A                       A
      |    A                A                 A
      |                                    A                       A  A
      |         A
100   +                                                          A
      |       A
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups           17
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                         NAME=net.unix-wizards

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
      |
550   +
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |         A  A
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |                                                  A         A
250   +                 A
      |                        A                                      A
      |                   A
      |       A             A           A           A        A
200   +                             A      A
      |              A            A                           A  A
      |                                       A A
      |                               A
150   +                                                A
      |  A                                        A
      |
      |
100   +    A
      |
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups           18
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                         NAME=net.unix-wizards

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +            A
      |  A      A
      |                                                  A
      |
      |                                         A
200   +       A                                              A     A
      |                   A         A   A  A                          A
      |                 A   A                 A     A  A         A
      |              A         A  A               A           A
      |                               A
100   +    A
      |
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups           19
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=net.women

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
      |
550   +
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |                                       A A
450   +
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |                                             A
      |
      |                                           A
250   +                                    A
      |
      |                                                  A   A
      |                 A
200   +
      |                   A                                        A  A
      |                                                          A
      |
150   +                                                       A
      |            A                    A
      |
      |                     A
100   +                               A
      |              A              A                  A
      |  A    A                A  A
      |         A
 50   +    A
      |
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1             Time varying activity of the top 10 newsgroups           20
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:20 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=net.women

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |                                         A
700   +                                       A
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |                                           A
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +                                             A
      |
      |                                    A
      |                                                  A
      |
300   +                 A
      |                                                      A
      |                                                          A
      |                   A                                   A       A
      |                                                            A
200   +            A
      |
      |              A
      |                     A           A              A
      |
100   +  A    A                     A A
      |         A              A  A
      |    A
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites               1
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=acf4.UUCP

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +                                           A
      |
      |                                       A
110   +                        A
      |                                 A
      |
100   +
      |                                         A
      |
 90   +
      |
      |                               A
 80   +                                    A
      |
      |                             A
 70   +
      |
      |                                             A
 60   +         A
      |            A
      |                           A
 50   +                     A
      |
      |
 40   +                 A
      |
      |       A
 30   +                   A
      |    A                                             A            A
      |                                                       A  A
 20   +
      |  A                A                                  A     A
      |
 10   +              A
      |                                                A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites               2
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=acf4.UUCP

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +                        A
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |                                           A
100   +                               A       A
      |                                 A       A
      |
      |    A    A  A        A     A A      A        A
      |       A      A  A B                              A   AA  A    A
  0   +  A                                             A           A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites               3
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                            NAME=drutx.UUCP

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |                                                          A
 70   +
      |                                                  A
      |
 60   +                                                      A        A
      |
      |                                    A
 50   +                               A A                     A    A
      |                                             A
      |                   A
 40   +         A                 A
      |                             A           A
      |
 30   +                 A A A                 A   A
      |
      |            A           A
 20   +                                                A
      |
      |  A A  A
 10   +              A
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites               4
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                            NAME=drutx.UUCP

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |                 A A
      |
      |
300   +
      |                             A
      |                           A
      |
      |
200   +
      |                   A
      |
      |                     A
      |
100   +                                                          A
      |                                           A A    A         A  A
      |         A                     A A  A                 AA
      |                                       A A
      |  A A       A           A                       A
  0   +       A      A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites               5
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                            NAME=fluke.UUCP

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |                                                  A
 60   +                        A                                 A
      |  A                                 A
      |         A  A        A           A
 50   +                                                      AA
      |    A                                  A   A                A
      |       A      A  A A                     A
 40   +                                             A                 A
      |                               A
      |
 30   +
      |                             A                  A
      |                           A
 20   +
      |
      |
 10   +
      |                   A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites               6
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                            NAME=fluke.UUCP

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |                                                  A
      |                                           A
100   +                                 A     A A   A        A   A    A
      |       A      A  A   A  A           A                  A
      |  A A    A  A      A           A                A           A
      |                           A A
      |                   A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites               7
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=nsc.UUCP

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +         A
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |                 A A
      |
 50   +  A         A                            A
      |                                       A
      |              A    A         A
 40   +    A                                                  A
      |       A                A                             A
      |
 30   +                                    A                     A
      |                     A     A                 A    A
      |                               A           A    A
 20   +                                 A
      |                                                            A
      |
 10   +
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites               8
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                             NAME=nsc.UUCP

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +                               A
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |              A
      |         A       A A    A
100   +  A                                    A
      |                                                      AA
      |    A       A      A         A           A A A            A
      |       A             A     A     A  A           A A         A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites               9
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                            NAME=pyuxd.UUCP

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |                                                  A
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +                             A                                 A
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +                           A
      |                                                       A
      |                                             A            A
 70   +                                                      A
      |
      |                                                            A
 60   +
      |                   A A
      |                                       A
 50   +                                                A
      |
      |                               A
 40   +                                         A A
      |
      |                        A
 30   +       A                            A
      |         A
      |            A                    A
 20   +
      |
      |    A
 10   +              A  A A
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites              10
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                            NAME=pyuxd.UUCP

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +                                                  A
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +                             A
      |                                                      A        A
      |                                                          A
      |                           A
      |
200   +                                             A         A
      |                                                            A
      |                   A                   A
      |                     A         A                A
      |
100   +                        A                A
      |         A                                 A
      |       A    A                    A  A
      |    A            A A
      |              A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites              11
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                            NAME=ucbvax.ARPA

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |                                                       A
 80   +
      |                                                          A
      |                                                      A
 70   +
      |
      |                                                            A
 60   +                   A             A         A      A
      |                     A     A
      |                               A
 50   +                                       A     A
      |  A    A                A                       A
      |            A    A A         A           A
 40   +    A
      |                                    A
      |
 30   +              A
      |
      |
 20   +         A
      |
      |
 10   +
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites              12
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                            NAME=ucbvax.ARPA

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +                   A
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |                                                       A
300   +
      |
      |                               A
      |
      |                                                      A
200   +                                                          A
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |                     A     A                    A           A
      |       A         A A             A       A A A    A
      |  A A       A A         A    A      A  A
      |         A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites              13
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           NAME=ucla-cs.UUCP

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |                   A                A
      |                                       A
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |                               A A
      |                             A             A
 60   +       A                                 A
      |
      |         A              A
 50   +                           A                                   A
      |
      |            A    A                           A    A
 40   +                                                      A     A
      |
      |    A         A      A
 30   +
      |
      |                   A                                   A
 20   +  A
      |
      |
 10   +
      |                                                A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites              14
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           NAME=ucla-cs.UUCP

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |                                 A  A
      |                   A           A
      |                           A A             A
100   +       A                               A
      |         A  A    A   A  A                A   A    A            A
      |                                                      A     A
      |    A         A                                        A
      |  A                A                            A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites              15
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           NAME=umcp-cs.UUCP

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |                                                  A
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +                                             A
      |       A
      |                                                            A
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +                                                       A
      |                                                      A
      |                                         A
 50   +
      |
      |  A                                    A   A    A         A    A
 40   +    A    A       A A
      |
      |                        A
 30   +            A A              A   A
      |                   A
      |                           A
 20   +                     A         A
      |                                    A
      |
 10   +
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites              16
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           NAME=umcp-cs.UUCP

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |                                                      AA
      |
      |                                                  A
200   +
      |
      |                                         A
      |              A                        A     A
      |                                                A
100   +       A                                                    A
      |         A                                                A    A
      |    A                        A             A
      |  A              A B    A  A   A A
      |            A        A              A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites              17
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           NAME=utastro.UUCP

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |                                                       A
      |                                       A     A
 70   +
      |                                                  A
      |                           A
 60   +
      |                             A
      |
 50   +                                         A                  A
      |
      |            A                       A                     A
 40   +                                                A
      |                                           A
      |         A                                            A
 30   +    A
      |       A
      |  A                  A  A        A
 20   +                 A
      |
      |              A    A
 10   +                   A                                           A
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites              18
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           NAME=utastro.UUCP

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |                                             A
      |
      |                                                  A
      |                           A                           A
100   +         A                             A
      |            A                A                  A           A
      |  A A  A                A           A    A A
      |              A  A               A                    A   A
      |                   B A                                         A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites              19
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                            NAME=utzoo.UUCP

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |                           A
      |
 90   +
      |                        A
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |                             A A
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +         A
      |              A
      |            A                                                  A
 40   +       A         A   A
      |                                                       A
      |  A
 30   +                                    A                     A A
      |                   A             A     A     A
      |                                                      A
 20   +                                         A        A
      |    A                                      A
      |                   A                            A
 10   +
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 10 sites              20
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:27 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                            NAME=utzoo.UUCP

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
900   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
800   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
700   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
600   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
500   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |                                                            A
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |                           A
100   +                        A    A
      |                               A
      |                 A   A                                         A
      |  A      A  A A    A             A     A               A
      |    A  A                            A    A A A    A   A   A
  0   +                   A                            A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users               1
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                          [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |                               A
 40   +                                 A
      |
      |                                             A    A
 30   +
      |
      |                                       A   A
 20   +                   A
      |                             A
      |       A         A                       A
 10   +         A           A              A
      |            A A         A  A                    A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users               2
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                          [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
 50   +
      |                                 A
      |                 A             A                  A
      |                             A         A     A
      |       A A    A    A A  A           A    A A    A
  0   +            A              A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users               3
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +                                                  A         A
      |
      |                                             A
 30   +       A
      |                                                      A
      |         A       A                       A
 20   +            A                    A     A   A           A
      |              A                                 A         A
      |A                          A        A                          A
 10   +  B A              A A       A
      |                        A      A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users               4
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |              A
      |
      |                                         A
100   +
      |
      |                                       A
      |                                                A     A
      |
 50   +         A                                        A
      |                                             A         A    A
      |
      |       A    A    A         A     A                             A
      |A B A              A A  A    A A    A      A              A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users               5
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                          [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |         A       A
      |  B
 40   +
      |
      |
 30   +    A         A    A    A                              A  A
      |            A                            A            A
      |A      A                     A         A          A
 20   +                                           A A  A
      |                     A     A        A                       A
      |                                 A
 10   +
      |                               A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users               6
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                          [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |                 A
      |
100   +                        A
      |  B           A
      |
      |         A                             A              AA
      |                   A                       A              A
 50   +A           A                            A
      |    A  A                     A               A  A A         A
      |                     A           A
      |                           A        A
      |                               A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users               7
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +                                         A
      |
      |
 30   +
      |                   A                A
      |                        A    A         A   A
 20   +                                             A
      |              A            A     A
      |    A  A
 10   +A                              A
      |  B      A           A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users               8
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |                        A
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
 50   +
      |                                           A
      |              A    A                     A
      |                     A              A        A
      |A   A  A A                 A A   A     A
  0   +  B                            A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users               9
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +
      |
      |
 30   +
      |
      |
 20   +
      |                                                       A
      |A B A  A A  A    A         A A         A A A A    A       A A
 10   +                                    A
      |              A    A    A        A              A     A        A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              10
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |  B      A  A                          A               A    A
      |A   A  A         A         A A      A    A A A    A       A
      |              A    A    A        A              A     A        A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              11
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                          [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +
      |                     A
      |
 30   +                   A
      |
      |                 A      A
 20   +                           A   A
      |                                    A
      |            A                A         A A                A A  A
 10   +                                             A
      |         A    A                  A                A   AA
      |  B                                        A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              12
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                          [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |
      |                     A
 50   +
      |
      |            A    A A
      |              A         A  A   A    A  A                  A A
      |         A                   A   A       A   A    A   AA       A
  0   +  B                                        A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              13
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |                               A
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +                                 A
      |
      |
 30   +
      |
      |       A                                     A
 20   +A        A                          A
      |
      |            A              A A                    A
 10   +                 A   A                   A
      |    A         A    A                   A   A           A
      |  B                     A                       A     A        A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              14
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |                               A
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +                     A           A
      |
      |                                    A
      |
      |
 50   +                           A
      |         A  A                                A
      |A      A         A                     A
      |                             A                    A
      |  B A         A    A                     A A    A     AA       A
  0   +                        A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              15
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +
      |
      |                                                               A
 30   +                                                          A
      |                   A                         A  A
      |                                                  A
 20   +                                       A              A
      |         A              A        A       A             A
      |                     A         A    A                       A
 10   +       A         A         A A             A
      |            A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              16
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |                                                               A
      |                                             A
      |
 50   +                                                A     A
      |                   A                   A          A    A  A
      |                        A      A A  A      A
      |         A           A     A             A                  A
      |       A         A           A
  0   +            A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              17
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +
      |                                             A
      |                                         A A      A
 30   +
      |
      |                                 A     A
 20   +                             A      A
      |
      |                           A
 10   +                               A                A     AA       A
      |                 A   A                                    A A
      |                        A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              18
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
 50   +                                           A A
      |                                       A A        A
      |                                 A  A
      |                             A                  A
      |                 A   A     A   A                      AA  A A  A
  0   +                        A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              19
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |                                                  A
 40   +
      |
      |                                             A        A
 30   +                                                            A
      |                                       A A             A
      |                                                          A
 20   +                                           A
      |                                                A
      |                                 A  A
 10   +                               A                               A
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              20
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |                                             A    A
      |
      |                                                      A
      |
 50   +                                                       A
      |                                       A   A              A A
      |                                 A       A      A
      |
      |                               A    A                          A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              21
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                         [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |                        A
      |         A
 40   +                                                               A
      |       A    A
      |              A                                        A
 30   +A
      |  B                                 A  A     A            A
      |                           A A
 20   +                                 A                A   A     A
      |                   A                     A A
      |    A            A   A         A                A
 10   +
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              22
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                         [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
 50   +                        A                                      A
      |A                                      A
      |  B    A A  A A                  A  A    A   A         A
      |                           A A                    A   A   A A
      |    A            A A A         A           A    A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              23
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +
      |       A
      |
 30   +                     A
      |
      |    A                   A        A  A
 20   +         A
      |
      |                   A                              A
 10   +            A    A         A A         A A
      |  B           A                A           A
      |                                             A  A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              24
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
 50   +
      |         A           A           A  A
      |       A                A                A        A
      |    A              A         A
      |  B           A  A         A   A       A   A A  A
  0   +            A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              25
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                          [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +                                         A A
      |
      |
 40   +
      |
      |                                       A          A
 30   +                                                      AA
      |
      |                                             A  A
 20   +
      |                                 A  A                          A
      |                               A                            A
 10   +                                                          A
      |                        A    A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              26
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                          [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |                                         A A
      |                                                A A    A
 50   +
      |                                       A     A        A        A
      |                                                            A
      |                               A A  A                     A
      |                        A    A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              27
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +                                                      A
      |
      |
 30   +
      |                   A                                      A
      |                     A
 20   +              A  A         A                           A
      |                        A                A                  A
      |         A  A                A A A     A
 10   +       A                            A        A    A
      |  B A                                      A    A
      |A                                                              A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              28
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
 50   +                                                      A
      |            A    A                                        A
      |              A    A       A                                A
      |         A           A  A                              A
      |       A                     A A A     A A A A  A A
  0   +A B A                               A                          A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              29
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |                                                  A
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +       A
      |
      |                                             A
 30   +                                                       A
      |                                                               A
      |  B A                                                 A   A A
 20   +A                                               A
      |
      |                             A           A A
 10   +                           A   A       A
      |         A  A      A    A        A  A
      |                     A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              30
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |                                                  A
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +                                                       A
      |
      |
      |       A                                     A            A
      |                                                      A        A
 50   +                                                A           A
      |                                         A
      |A   A                        A         A   A
      |  B      A                 A   A
      |                   A A  A        A
  0   +            A                       A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              31
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                         [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +                                           A
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |                                         A
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +                                       A
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |                                 A
 40   +
      |                                    A
      |                                             A
 30   +
      |
      |
 20   +                               A
      |
      |                             A
 10   +
      |
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              32
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                         [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +                                           A
      |
      |
      |
      |                                       A A
 50   +
      |
      |                               A A           A
      |                                    A
      |                             A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              33
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |A
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +
      |            A
      |
 30   +  B      A
      |              A                            A
      |                 A                     A          A
 20   +    A              A             A       A                A
      |       A             A         A             A  A     A
      |                             A                         A       A
 10   +                        A           A
      |                           A                                A
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              34
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                        [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |A                                          A
      |
      |                                             A    A            A
      |                                       A
 50   +            A        A                   A
      |         A       A             A A              A     AA  A
      |  B A  A      A    A
      |                        A  A A      A
      |                                                            A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              35
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                         [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +
      |
      |
 30   +
      |
      |                     A  A      A A                     A
 20   +
      |                             A         A     A                 A
      |                                                  A   A   A
 10   +                   A       A        A      A                A
      |A B A  A A  A    A                              A
      |              A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              36
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                         [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |                               A
      |
      |
      |
 50   +                     A  A    A   A           A         A
      |                                       A                       A
      |                                    A      A          A
      |  B                A       A                      A       A
      |A   A  A A  A A  A                              A           A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              37
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                         [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |                               A
 40   +
      |                             A
      |
 30   +
      |
      |                           A                      A
 20   +                                 A                    A
      |                                                          A
      |                        A              A A A           A       A
 10   +                                    A        A  A           A
      |
      |                     A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              38
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                         [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
 50   +
      |                             A A
      |                                                  A
      |                        A  A           A A            A        A
      |                     A           A  A      A A  A      A  A A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              39
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                          [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +
      |
      |                             A
 30   +         A
      |                           A
      |                                 A
 20   +                   A    A
      |                     A         A
      |       A    A    A                     A   A
 10   +A B                                 A
      |    A                                    A   A              A  A
      |                                                          A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              40
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                          [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |                             A
      |
      |         A         A       A     A
 50   +
      |                        A      A
      |       A             A                 A   A
      |A B A       A    A                  A        A                 A
      |                                         A                A A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              41
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |                                                               A
 40   +
      |  B
      |
 30   +
      |            A    A
      |                     A
 20   +
      |A
      |                   A
 10   +    A                                                  A
      |       A A    A         A  A A         A A                A
      |                               A A                A   A     A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              42
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                           [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |                                                               A
      |
 50   +  B
      |                 A
      |            A        A
      |A                  A       A           A
      |    A  A A    A         A    A A         A        A   AA  A A
  0   +                                 A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              43
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                          [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |                                                  A
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +                                                               A
      |                             A
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |                           A                           A
      |                                                          A
 70   +                                             A
      |                                                      A
      |                                                            A
 60   +
      |                   A A
      |                                       A
 50   +                                                A
      |
      |
 40   +                               A
      |                                         A A
      |                        A
 30   +                                    A
      |         A
      |       A    A                    A
 20   +
      |
      |    A
 10   +              A  A
      |  B
      |
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              44
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                          [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |                                                  A
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |                             A
      |                                                      A        A
      |
      |                                                          A
250   +
      |                           A
      |
      |
      |                                                       A
200   +                                             A
      |                                                            A
      |
      |
      |                   A                   A
150   +                     A         A
      |
      |                                                A
      |
      |
100   +                        A                A
      |
      |         A                                 A
      |            A                       A
      |                                 A
 50   +       A
      |    A
      |                 A
      |              A
      |  B
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              45
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                       [email protected]

        PLOT OF FILES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

FILES |
150   +
      |
      |
140   +
      |
      |
130   +
      |
      |
120   +
      |
      |
110   +
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
 90   +
      |
      |
 80   +
      |
      |
 70   +
      |
      |
 60   +
      |
      |
 50   +
      |
      |
 40   +  B
      |
      |
 30   +                                             A                 A
      |
      |                                                       A  A
 20   +    A                               A
      |            A      A                   A A            A
      |       A         A   A  A        A         A      A         A
 10   +A        A
      |                           A                    A
      |              A              A A
  0   +
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE
1               Time varying activity of the top 25 users              46
                     October 8/84 to November 23/85
                                            16:41 FRIDAY, MARCH 21, 1986
                       [email protected]

        PLOT OF BYTES*DATE    LEGEND: A = 1 OBS, B = 2 OBS, ETC.

BYTES |
450   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
400   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
350   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
300   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
250   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
200   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
150   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
100   +
      |
      |
      |
      |
 50   +                                             A
      |  B                                                            A
      |            A                       A  A               A
      |    A            A A A  A        A       A A      A   A   A A
      |A      A A    A            A                    A
  0   +                             A A
      -+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+
    11OCT84 30NOV84 19JAN85 10MAR85 29APR85 18JUN85 07AUG85 26SEP85

                                    DATE