Soul Calibur II
Liquid Talim FAQ
Version 1.0
(06/9/03)
by JinLaW
[email protected]
[email protected]
=-=-=Copyright of JinLaW=-=-=
This FAQ is intended to help Talim players to understand how to use her.
It's a smaller form of the Talim Strats forum of soulcalibur.com I did
some weeks ago. I, personally, am not an excellent Talim player, like
Seven or Shauno, but this FAQ is just the strategies Seven, Shauno,
Nuts, and all the members of the forum. BTW, you can put this FAQ
anywhere you want to, but give credits to me(JinLaW) and the Talim
Strats forums at soulcalibur.com. Let's get started.
=-=-=The Conventions=-=-=
A- Horizontal Attack
B- Vertical Attacks
K- Kick
G- Guard
=-=-=Movement Conventions=-=-=
7 8 9 u/b u u/f up-back up up-forward
4 5 6 = b N f = back neutral forward
1 2 3 d/b d d/f down-back down down-forward
=-=-=Special Conventions=-=-=
+ - Moves must be done together
, - Moves must be done right after the other
_ - Or (When used between two moves, they are interchangable)
* - return joystick to the neutral position
[] - Hold down the selected button(s) for possible delay or change up
> - possible delay between moves
~ - buttons pressed immediately after the other
() - Parenthesis indicates optional moves in a string
: - Requires Precise timing
FC - Do move during full crouched position
WS - While standing up (Returning the stick to neutral from a crouch)
WJ - while jumping (pressing ub_u_uf and G)
WL - while landing (coming down from a jump)
RN - While running
BK - Back facing the opponent
=-=-=Notes Conventions=-=-=
GI - Guard Impact
GB - Guard Break
GP - Guard Push (blocked hit pushes opponent back, but remains in block)
CH - Counter Hit
SC - During Soul Charge
JF - Just Frame (only a small window in animation to perform move)
! - Unblockable
[] - goes into or ends in the stance indicated between the brackets
/ - seperates comments
# - followed by a number means comment reference in NOTES
() - Parenthesis indicates optional moves in a string
{} - Curved brackets indicate buttons needed to break a throw
===================
|------Index-------|
===================
I. Talim Strenghts and weaknesses by Seven
II. Movelist by rev
III. Move Analysis by Seven, Shauno and Ai-Uchi
IV. Multi-throw timing and Set-ups by Seven and Shauno
V. Guard Impact Game(GI) by Seven
VI. Moving forward by Seven
VII. Ring Out Game by Seven
VIII. Soul Charge Unblockables(SCUBs) by Shauno
IX. Custom Strings by Shauno
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
=================================
I. Talim Strenghts and Weaknesses|
=================================
Strengths
On the most fundamental level, everyone should realize Talim's speed is
one of her biggest advantages. It allows for quick interrupts, continued
offense in smart offensive fashion, etc.
Another advantage is Talim's evasive qualities. By far the most evasive
character in the game. But most people don't realize that the biggest
portion of her evasiveness does not come from backturn evade or canned
strings with evade options. Many of Talim's moves are tech crouch, in
fact, a lot of the most important moves are. This is something all Talim
players most be aware of, because most of the moves used to stop Talim
from evading are high.
A strength that most Talim players do not realize, however, is simply
the sheer amount of knockdown moves she uses. Knockdown puts the
opponent at the mercy of Talim's wakeups, another of Talim's strengths.
So many knockdowns take a huge mental hit on the opponent, and
frustration is a major part of beating the opponent.
Another strength that is not so obvious. All of Talim's lows, except for
backturn 2A, are safe. No risk lows is a definite plus.
A strength that often is forgotten is Talim's cancels. A+BG and B+KG
mostly. Even though Talim lacks string cancels to a certain extent(you
could consider AST options string cancels if you wanted to) , they are
almost always flashy enough to get a reaction.
Weaknesses
On the subject of Talim's weaknesses, everyone knows how little damage
she deals is a major factor. Another weakness is the way the weight
system works in calibur 2. The lightest character in the game is going
to be the easiest to space. Since most characters are going to not want
to ever be in Talim's ideal range, it makes it so you'll need to get
back into that range frequently.
============
II. Movelist|
============
GRAPPLING TECHNIQUES:
(front) A+G {A}
B+G {B}
236+B+G {B}
236+B+G,46+A+B {B}
214+B+K JF
(left) A+G_B+G {A_B}
(right) A+G_B+G {A_B}
(back) A+G_B+G {Astroth & Voldo can escape}
NORMAL TECHNIQUES: NOTES:
A,A #1
A,A,B
A,A,B,(8_2) [SP]
A,A,B
A,A,B,K #2
A,B
1+A
2+A
3+A #3
3+A,A
4+A,A
4+A,[K]
6+A,A
6+A,B
44+A,A,A
44+A,A,A,236+B
44+A,[A]
B,A #1
B,B,(8_2) [SP]
B,B,A
B,B,K
B,B,K,6 [FF]
B,B,4+K [BT]
1+B(8_2) [SP]
1+B,6 [FF]
1+B,4 [BT]
2+B
1+B,6+[B]
6+B,A,(8_2) [SP]
6+B,A,6 [FF]
6+B,A,4 [BT]
6+B,B
4+B,(8_2) [SP]
4+B,6 [FF]
4+B,B
44+B
66+B
236+[B]
214+B #1 / !
K
1+K
2+K,A
2+K,[A]
3+K
4+K
6+K
44+K
66+K
A+B #1 / #3 / GB
6+A+B #1
66+A+B
3+A+B
1+A+B
2+A+B
2+A+B,(8_2) [SP]
2+A+B,6 [FF]
2+A+B,4 [BT]
4+A+B #3
B+K #1 / GB
(9_7)+B+K half-spin #3
4+B+K
FC+A
FC+B
FC+3+B,B
FC+K
WS+A
WS+B
BK A,A
BK A,A,(8_2) [SP]
BK A,A,6 [FF]
BK A,A,4 [BT]
BK d2A
BK B,B
BK K
BK 6+K #3
BK A+K GI to stun
BK B+K GI
BK FC+K
WJ+A
WJ+A.(8_2) [SP]
WJ+A,6 [FF]
WJ+A,4 [BT]
WJ+B
WJ+B,K #2
WJ+K
WL+A
WL+B
WL+K
FRONT FLIP - [FF]:
6+B+K Front Flip
A
B
K #4
4+K #3
BACK TWIST:
B GB
8-WAY RUN:
6+A,A#
6+B
6+K Slide
6+A+B
6+B+K [FF]
(9_3)+A
(9_3)+B,6+[B]
(9_3)+K,A
A+B
(7_8_9_1_2_3)+B+K Full Spin
A
(8_2)+B+K Can run up wall
B+G (throw)
(8_2)+A,(8_2) [SP]
(8_2)+B
(8_2)+B,6 [FF]
(8_2)+K
(7_1)+A
(7_1)+B,(8_2) [SP]
(7_1)+B,6 [FF]
(7_1)+K
4+A,A,A
4+A,A,A,236+B
4+B
4+K
4+B+K
NOTES:
[SP]: halfspin up or down
[FF]: if attacked, will do front flip
[BT]: if attacked, will do back twist
#1: G to cancel
#2: k at end of string against wall will add extra hit
#3: leaves you in BK
#4: if connects, performs another front flip
==================
III. Move Analysis|
==================
The entire movelist isn't going to be analyzed, just the most important
moves.
8_2B+K
She gets around the opponent like nothing else. Instead of 8_2 B+K~8_2
its better if you SS first before doing the BT command for a potent
double SS. Doing it the first way pulls you out to BT. Any movement from
BT makes her face forward.
8WR9_3A
This move incorporates every Talim strength in a single move. Hits mid,
always knocks down, tracks like 360 degrees in its spin animation, goes
under high attacks, and because of the input (9~9_3~3) you can get an
advancing sidestep out of it. It's range is decievingly long, but not
long enough to do it from too great a distance. It is the perfect
solution to AAs that interrupt your spin transitions. The most common
use is Talim's AA8_2. Now if you do this command to sidestep spin left
or right after the AAs were blocked, the opponent can AA you before you
can continue the pressure, but if you instead input AA8_2~A she enters
her SS with the anti-high Seisutivo, totally owning the opponent's
attack. It also comes out in moves like 2A+B and 1B and BT AA(!). Just
follow with an 8_2~A if the opponent attacks.
1A
Probably Talim's best low. It moves her forward quite a bit, is safe of
course, and most importantly, gives Talim advantage on hit. 2 frames of
advantage is HUGE for the quickest character in the game. The way most
people react to lows is to try and counter the next thing that's done.
However, Talim's WS B will beat EVERY characters every option except
step. And most characters do not have an option to beat 6BB either,
after a 1A hit. This makes for one of Talim's few large damage setups.
If they start turtling up after 1A, just multithrow(236G+B, 46A+B,
214B+K), and let the mindgames begin.
B strings
BB is probably Talim's most important interrupt. 11 frame mid is
absolutely great. The variety that comes off of these strings is
important as well. BB is something that can sometimes allow Talim to
continue her offense if used smart. For example, BB8, cancel the
backturn, BBK. If the opponent isn't paying attention, the BBK is likely
to hit on counter, due to opponent trying to punish another backturn.
BB8_2 is not used for it's evasive properties, but rather to continue
offense. BB8_2 into actual backturn moves is only useful very sparingly.
BBK6, BB4K, and BB4K4 are again only useful sparingly. Another tidbit
with BBK is that most people respond to the forced crouch block with a
WS move. Most WS moves are fairly linear, allowing you to easily move to
one side and hit with a 8WR 3_9A or some such. The BA variation is
another move that is probably better used sparingly. Against a stepping
opponent, you may want the qualities of the B, but also want the A just
in case they step the B. BA is totally situational. Lastly, BBA is
largely useless now, especially due to the speed decrease from ver A to
ver D. I use it maybe once every 30 or so games now, however, when I do
use it, it always hits, because the opponent never sees it. Keep this in
mind.
A strings
AA is Talim's second most important interrupt. Since it can be broken
and is high, it's somewhat more limited, but due to it's speed, it's
going to be very useful against a spaz opponent. AAB is not useful AT
ALL. However, AAdelayB is useful once in a while. But if overused, it's
going to result in you taking some heavy damage. On block, AAB is at
terrible disadvantage. AA8_2 is important to lead into AST1, but I'll
discuss that more when I get to AST1. AB is another situational string.
Against ducking opponents, sometimes you may want the qualities of A,
but also want to punish if they duck.
66AA
Great for cutting off 8WR and step. Sometimes you may want to cut it off
and just do the 66A by itself, on hit or block. Hit will lead to more
offense options, block, sometimes you're better off only doing the 66A.
This move is mostly important because of the high damage(comparitively)
of the natural combo, and the knockdown properties. I've never known an
opponent not to try teching this move, and there's a wakeup mixup pretty
much guarunteed off the tech.
A+B
This move is of huge importance due to the backturn cancel. After using
it a couple times, opponents will remember to turtle up to it, leaving
them open to backturn and backturn cancls. That, and after a few times
of cancelling it, likely they'll start trying to hit you out of it late.
Let the move finish, and it's HUGE damage. The guard crush properties of
this move is pretty limited. I.E. they don't have to re-gi anything at
all unless you are pushing them into a wall.
B+K
Another important cancel. And this one has a slightly different
application than A+B, but also has some of the same applications. The
guard crush properties will of course be better if you're pushing
someone into a wall, but even if you aren't, they have to re-gi 66B. 66B
is easy to see coming after the guard crush, but if you use it very
sparingly, it will hit whenever you need it to. The cancel of this move
moves you quite a ways forward, so think about applications where you
need to be in close for a strong mixup after you cancel this move.
Multithrows, lows, strong fast mids (3B6B), etc.
236G+B, 46A+B, 214B+K (multithrow)
See part IV for analysis.
1A+B
Another tech crouch move. But also very quick, and Talim's best
launcher. Less reliable to counter highs though, the window is much
smaller. 44B is the best guarunteed damage after the launcher, and
leaves you in a decent position for wakeups. 8WR8_2B is a decent
finisher also, because of the options off the move, like AS forward,
they're going to need to block an air sault wakeup.
WS B
I believe I tested this as 12 frames. That makes it probably the fastest
WS move in the game. On counter, fall back stun, which leads to good
wakeups. Run in wakeups, air sault wakeups, guard crush cancel wakeups,
are all useful. The point is to take advantage of the situation after
this move.
WS A
Better range, more damage, knockdown, and ringout properties as compared
to WS B. This move is better in situations to punish certain lows which
you know you'll get no counterhit on WS B, or when you need the ringout
properties.
6B+K(air sault)
If you're training your opponent correctly, you'll never get hit out of
airsault. A pretty bold statement I'm sure, but it's just a question of
knowing when to perform the jump. Although I don't airsault as much
these days, it's still an important way to move yourself in and an
important mixup when you land. Sometimes it's best just to do the jump,
and attack once you get in. There are plenty of applications with this
move.
AST1
AST1 A is just another way of doing Talim's best move(8WR9_3A). AST1 G+A
and G+B is a STRONG throw that leaves Talim at HUGE advantage
afterwards. 8 frames, and she's a character with a 10 frame A.
Admittedly, these throws are completely unsafe. But with these throws,
it's all about the risk, because it WILL lead to more damage after the
throw. Guard crushes, guard crush cancels, coin toss games, etc are all
good afterwards. The important thing to remember is the opponent is not
likely to start ducking this throw for a long time, because they only
notice the minimal 15 damage the throw itself does. Which, by the way,
takes on both successful throw attempt and broken throw attempt.
Backturn(AST2)
Some backturn moves are naturally more important than others, but all
need to be used. Backturn 2A is probably the most used backturn move,
but it must be moderated, because it is after all, Talim's only unsafe
low. But on hit, it's knockdown. Such a dillemma. Backturn BB is a great
knockdown. Backturn K is good ringout material, Backturn 2K is a great
low. In fact, BT 2K is probably more useful than BT 2A.
3A+B
One of Talim's longest range moves, and quick. Admittedly, I don't use
this near as much as I should. It's a good long range interrupt, and
also good for punishing things normally out of Talim's range. Something
to play around with.
44K
Quick low, safe, knockdown on counter. Again, another safe Talim low can
come through. Most people are going to either spaz or step afterwards,
know your opponent. But it's something that will let you keep your
offense going if it hits. BB if they spaz.
6A+B
Although this move is a little slower, it's range, very decent tracking,
high damage, and terrific break attribute make it a move worth using.
This is the move I use to beat A's I know are coming. This is important
because as mentioned above, lots of A's are going to be used to stop
Talim's evasion. You anticipate correctly, you get the counter damage
for 60 or some(I forget) plus wakeups. Not too shabby. And oh yeah, it's
a SCUB on level 3 soul charge. Talim's only useful SCUB.
4BB and variations
4B is in every way a plain run of the mill move, and also is very
unique. 4BB itself is good for the counterhit, guaranteeing the second
hit and ringout if in the right position. 4B8_2 is the quickest way to
AST2 from a string. BB is 2 hits, 4B is one. 4B6_8_2 can have many
applications as a fake, etc etc. It's important to use.
4A strings
This I mostly use on wakeups. The first hit can whiff, so it looks like
opponent can get up with an attack... but the second hits come out fast
enough to hit them for counter as they're getting up. If they hesitate
enough, 4A[K] is really good damage. 4A strings by themselves of course
can be useful, if limited. I do not know frames, but 4A[K] is definitely
solid block stun, enough to continue your offense.
8WR3_9KA
A solid move with applications that most people never think of. The K
can whiff, and the A portion will counter. Important on wakeups and all
sorts of other times. The K portion is tech jump, and if they get used
to seeing the full string, cut it off to just the K, then multithrow. It
works well. Mess around with this move. Another thing to note is that
the K pushes the opponent quite a bit to Talim's left and off axis... I
have yet to experiment too much with this, but I'm guessing that almost
anything the opponent can throw out will miss if Talim evades right.
3B6B
Another very solid move. I always do the full string, if 3B hits then
you can stop delaying the 6B part in time to make it guaranteed. After
that, a 1K or 2B is guaranteed, I think, but I always opt for wakeup
games. Sometimes I airsault over the opponent and use backturn wakeups.
The important thing is, this move slams the opponent down in a strange
way, and wakeups are all that much more potent than usual. Other things
to note about this move is it is hard to see the second portion
accurately for the opponent. Vary the timing, occasionally do the full
guard crush, etc. The first few times you will need to train opponent to
it by hitting them with the fast version.
2KA
Why 2K works is hard to describe. It's so slow, that it's almost too
obvious. Test this move out after cancels(B+KG, KG, 6A+BG are the best)
and you might be surprised. However, it's probably best never to do the
A portion. After 2K hit, FCB is almost guarunteed, since it is very hard
to tech. And again, this low is totally safe, as long as you don't use
the A.
1B
In my opinion, the best way of setting up autododge. But also in itself
a very quick mid, and sometimes good to use for the knockdown
properties. Look at the autododge section for more.
FC3BB
The FC3B is tech crouch for all of it's portion. Very important. Plus
the second part can be delayed like mad. Only bad thing is it's
completely linear.
8WR1_7B
This move is an important way to move inside for Talim. Tracks fairly
well, tech jump I believe, fairly quick, and good air sault and AST1
options. The way this move is, it's probably the most confusing way to
set up AST1 and air sault options after a move, and works really well
for Talim.
4A+B
This move can provide perfect retaliation to EVERY character, the thing
is to know your spacing. Find certain situations it is useful in, and
remember that the backturn after it can be cancelled. This move is also
fairly good at breaking.
44A and string
A very interesting string. 44A by itself is PERFECT range for air sault
wakeups on hit, ring out, etc. I have real fun finding ways to whiff the
first 2 hits of the move though, and get the rest of the string to hit
(the last AA236B part). Good to set up after certain knockdowns, but
unfortunately it is kind of slow, so that needs to be remembered.
66K
This move is sort of magical. It tracks really well, and sometimes
leaves you in backturn, sometimes not. Good setup for the backturn auto-
parries on block, if you're left in backturn, it's just necessary to
know how your opponent will react.
9B
Don't forget this move when you need to jump over lows. On hit leaves
you in backturn.
==================================
IV. Multi-throw timing and set-ups|
==================================
236G+B, 46A+B, 214B+K
Timing
The escape is only 6 frames. 70 damage and 16 frame impact. The timing
for the multipart is like this: 236G+B, immediately after the throw
impacts(basically right away) press 46A+B. As soon as you have done
that, mash in 214B+K. If you can get the timing down every time without
mashing it, good for you, but it doesn't matter, because Talim's multi
cannot be broken after the initial throw. Here's another thing I've
noticed about the multi. After the arm break(46A+B), the camera will
switch sides. So doing the multi will feel like this sequence instead:
236B+G, 46A+B, 236B+K.
Set-Ups
It's good to do the multi after the following:
-BT B+K, 66A
Takes about 60% of your opponents life gauge without the okizeme!!!!
-BT 2K, 88_22K
Being hit twice tends to make people defend.
-BBA, 2A
Like above, being hit 4 times really freezes them often. A bit risky,
though, remember what was said in the movelist analysis part(III) about
the speed decrease of the A in the string BBA from version A to D?? Do
it only if the A of BBA connects to be safe with frame advantage.
-88_22A
if it connects fairly close, it recovers very fast for an attempt.
-AA~8_2
If they start to block the ~8_2 AST1 A, come from the SS spin with a
buffered multi-throw instead.
Some other things:
I(Shauno) threw the opponent with a 236 G+B (with out the full multi-
part command). He ended up in Play Dead position (PLD is a Tekken term
for face up, head towards) so I did a 2B to hit him as he tried to rise.
This forced him to rise in BT position (FC at that I think). Even though
he then pressed guard (so he said), I was able to hit him in the back
again with 6A+B. It'll be kinda nice if we can get some consistency with
this:
Opponent PLD, 2B, 6A+B
=====================
V. Guard Impact Game |
=====================
Post GI game
Talim's post GI game is actually fairly strong. 1A+B is the best option
if your opponent doesn't re-GI quickly. Good guaranteed damage. 66A will
hit people who GI with 4G for good damage. People who GI high will eat
1A or 2K, both of which are somewhat delayed, especially 2K, so they are
useful by themselves as delayed options. 1K or 44K is the fast low
option. Throw in guard crushes(B+K and A+B) and their cancels, you've
got a barrel full of damage and fun. 6A+B is also good post GI.
==================
VI. Moving Forward|
==================
One thing Talim players occasionally lack is patience, I know I(Seven
talking) lack it sometimes. Talim's ways of moving in are not strong or
obvious, and sometimes it takes a lot of patience and experimentation.
Some of the various ways to move in I've found are...
-GI
Against Astaroth and some of the other players than can push Talim out
really well, sometimes this is what you'll have to resort to. Good thing
Talim's post GI game is fairly strong.
66B
Too bad it's a crap move. Terrible recovery on block, high, linear. The
only thing it has going for it is break.
66A
It's hard to move in with this anyways. Your time has to be good, and
the move isn't all that long ranged. But it's important that she has it,
because a lot of times the simplest way to get in is to run forward, and
you'll usually end up doing a 66 move.
6A+B
When you're at range to use it, and you know it's going to hit, you can
use it, and then move in for the wakeups.
1A
This low moves you forward. Gives advantage on hit. Nuff said.
66K
Same thing with 66A. But it does track really well.
6B+K
An obvioius way to move in, I suppose... but not so obvious is to just
use the jump to move in. Usually you will get some hesitation out of
your opponent when used properly.
33A
Ok, this really isn't a move used to move in... it is however, very
powerful when you're just outside of Talim's ideal close range. When
this move hits, wakeups ensue. Fun times for all.
B+K and A+B cancels
Moving in with this is not obvious at all, but it is VERY useful and
very important. Most people only think about the guard crush and damage
properties when they see these moves. It's very deceptive to use it as a
way to move inside, and unless your opponent knows you're going to
cancel, they should be turtling up. These guard crushes are NOT slow if
used properly. Just remember to use them when the opponent has eaten
enough A's and will not be thinking about moving to the side.
===================
VII. Ring Out Game |
===================
Talim's RO game is basically composed of 33A or WSA. Don't forget most
of her throws ring out.
======================================
VIII. Soul Charge Unblockables(SCUBs) |
======================================
Most of you know that if you attack while soul charging, you'll keep the
charge as long as your attacks don't hit or are blocked. What you may
not know is that GI'ing while charging up doesn't cause the SC to
dissapate. In fact I(Shauno) was able to get at least 10+ SCUBs today in
matches by using this technique.
- After knocking down the opponent, immediately press A+B+K. You can't
8WR until you're at least lvl 2.
- Once you can, dash in towards the opponent and simply GI their attack
if they throw one out. By this time you should be at lvl 3... SCUB time!
After the GI mix up these lvl 3 unblockables:
236+B (juggle starter!)
6A+B (a bit slower, drops them in front of you for okizeme)
A+B (slow animation...rolls them away)
B+K (slow animation...rolls them away)
The varying animation speeds allow you to get around re-GI attempts.
Remember, you can also charge 236[B] just enough to avoid a re-GI as
well and you'll still have an unblockable.
This technique has an interesting effect on the opponent's defense.
Eventually he'll choose not to attack for fear of the SCUB options.
That's when you can go for the 6B+K B GC discussed earlier, along with
dashing multi throw, or a simple SCUB like 6A+B. 8WR'ing with B+K dodges
help to keep the opponent guessing when/if the attack will come.
Summary... supercharge often! If they turtle, dash in and SCUB_throw
them. If they try to interrupt this strat, GI first then SCUB them
anyway.
=====================
VIII. Custom Strings |
=====================
-1A, FC 2K, WS+K, K, 6K
- BT 2K, 2A, FC 3BB - This one is pretty much uninterruptable it seems,
with the 3BB avoiding any high attacks.
- BT 2K, 88_22 K, multithrow_1A+B - If the cartwheel kick hits, do the
mixup (1A+B is uninterruptable). If not, GI or dodge because of the good
recovery.
- BT 2K, 88_22A~8_2 AST1A_(multithrow_1A+B). 88_22A is an under rated
move with a lot of speed and anti 8WR attributes. If it is blocked, go
into ~8_2 AST1 A for protection. If it hits, the opponent is standing so
use the frame advantage (if it gives you any) for a multi or 1A+B mixup.
Special thanks to:
Seven, Shauno, Nuts, Ai-Uchi, rev(for the movelist), and the whole Talim
forum community of soulcalibur.com.
THE END!!!
