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From: Daniel Kim <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: The ">From" filter
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I realized that Pine filters sentences starting with "From" and adds the
">" leadin to that line.

(eg. I did not type the ">" before From in the following sentence)

>From the inventor of Perl, Larry Wall provides a unique perspective on
the evolution of Perl and its future direction.

Is there a way to disable this feature?

--dk

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From [email protected] Fri Jun 1 09:03:00 2001 -0700
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From: V V Raja Rao <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: folders with new mails
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Hai,

I am using pine 4.33. Is it possible to configure pine such that the
folders containing new mails will be highlighted as soon as I open
pine?(as in Yahoo, as soon as you login the folders containing new mails
will be highlighted)

Thanks in advance,
Raja.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
238,Hostel-1,
IIT,Powai
Mumbai-76
091-022-5721017,5720093
http://www.cse.iitb.ac.in/~raja

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From: Steven Whatley <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: folders with new mails
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0106012127160.12628-100000@chandra.cse.iitb.ernet.in>
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On Fri, 1 Jun 2001, V V Raja Rao wrote:
> I am using pine 4.33. Is it possible to configure pine such that the
> folders containing new mails will be highlighted as soon as I open
> pine?(as in Yahoo, as soon as you login the folders containing new mails
> will be highlighted)

I don't know how to do that but I got a script called newmail.sh that gets
called when I login.

newmail.sh:
#!/bin/ksh
#
# Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 12:11:38 -0600 (CST)
# From: Mike Miller <[email protected]>
# To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
# Subject: incoming folders (was Re: Ok, here I go again!)
#

if [ `wc /var/mail/swhatley | awk '{print $1}'` == 0 ]; then
echo ""
echo "No mail in Inbox"
else
echo ""
egrep '^From ' /usr/mail/swhatley | wc | awk '{print "Listing of "$1" messages in your inbox:"}'
echo ""
for item in `egrep -n '^From ' /usr/mail/swhatley | awk -F: '{print $1}'`; do
tail +$item /var/mail/swhatley | egrep '^From: ' | head -1
tail +$item /var/mail/swhatley | egrep '^From: |^Subject: ' | tail +2 | head -1 | egrep -v '^From: '
echo ""
done
fi
echo ""
echo "Messages in other inboxes:"
echo ""
for file in `ls -1 ~/Mail/.Incoming/IN.* | grep -v lock | awk -F. '{print $NF}'`; do
echo "IN.$file `egrep '^From ' ~/Mail/.Incoming/IN.$file | wc`" | awk '{print $2"\t"$1}' | grep -v ^0\
done
echo ""
# end

This script shows me the the "From:" and "Subject:" for new mails. And it
shows me how many new messages that I have in my various IN.* files.

I hope this helps,
Steven

From [email protected] Fri Jun 1 10:11:37 2001 -0700
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From: "Scott Mohnkern" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Fw: Pine 4.33 for Solaris 5.6?
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> Does anyone have a copy of a compiled pine 4.33 for Solaris 5.6?
>
> At the washington archive, they've got it for 5.8, but not 5.6.
>
>
> Scott Mohnkern
>
>

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From [email protected] Fri Jun 1 10:43:49 2001 -0700
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From: Mac Newbold <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: The ">From" filter
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And it came to pass that Today, at 8:13am, Daniel Kim said:

>I realized that Pine filters sentences starting with "From" and adds the
>">" leadin to that line.
>
>(eg. I did not type the ">" before From in the following sentence)
>
>>From the inventor of Perl, Larry Wall provides a unique perspective on
>the evolution of Perl and its future direction.
>
>Is there a way to disable this feature?

I don't think that is what you really want to do. If From appears at the
beginning of a line, it will confuse some mail servers and readers, since it
looks like the From header. The easiest workaround is to make sure that From
doesn't appear on the left margin. I believe that even whitespace will do it.

Mac

--
Mac Newbold Univ. of Utah Computer Science Dept.
[email protected] http://www.cs.utah.edu/~newbold/

From [email protected] Fri Jun 1 11:15:53 2001 -0700
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From: Jacob Morzinski <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: The ">From" filter
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
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On Fri, 1 Jun 2001, Daniel Kim wrote:
> I realized that Pine filters sentences starting with "From" and adds the
> ">" leadin to that line.
[...]
> Is there a way to disable this feature?

You can use pine's Configuration screen to control how aggressive
pine is about doing this. If you only ever read your mbox folder
with pine, you can disable the feature save-will-quote-leading-froms.
If you use programs other than pine to access your mbox, it would
be a good idea to leave the feature enabled. Some programs split
your mbox into messages at each point where a line begins with a
>From followed by a space (like this line), and these programs will
break messages in half if pine doesn't insert the leading ">".

(Also, note that pine is not alone in putting ">" on the front of
"From "-lines. The servers which handle the mail could be doing
this before pine is even shown the message.)

Jacob Morzinski [email protected]

From [email protected] Mon Jun 4 06:38:29 2001 -0700
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From: Joel Boonstra <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: folders with new mails
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0106012127160.12628-100000@chandra.cse.iitb.ernet.in>
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> I am using pine 4.33. Is it possible to configure pine such that the
> folders containing new mails will be highlighted as soon as I open
> pine?(as in Yahoo, as soon as you login the folders containing new mails
> will be highlighted)

There was another reply to this that may be more robust, but this seems to
work as well, with no scripting involved.

Make sure you have 'enable-aggregate-command-set' enabled in your
configuration, then set your 'initial-keystroke-list' set to the
following:

l,;,p,u,z

That will show you only the folders that have new mail. If you want to
see all of them, with just the newmail folders highlighted, remove the 'z'
from the end, i.e.:

l,;,p,u

That works for me, at least :)

--
Joel Boonstra
[email protected]

From [email protected] Mon Jun 4 06:55:07 2001 -0700
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From: Jessie Kleefstra <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Pine 4.33 Filters
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Hi
I asked about this problem below but no one answered me. Is it because you
don't know, it's a bug or is just a plain stupid question? We would really
like to upgrade to 4.33 and use this filtering because it seem much easier
for our Faculty, Staff and Students to use instead of Procmail.

On Fri, 25 May 2001, Jessie Kleefstra wrote:

>
> I'm testing Pine 4.33 with Solaris 8. I have set up a simple filter but
> receive an abort signal. Below is the example. Is it because the 'From
> pattern' requires an '@' sign or a '.'? I couldn't find anything in the
> documentation that specifically stated this. If so, which other patterns
> require this as well? Thanks for your help.
>
>
> Nickname = test
> >From pattern = kleefstr
>
> (*) Specific
> Folder List = INBOX
>
> (*) Move
> to Folder = testing
>
> Commit changes ("Yes" replaces settings, "No" abandons changes)? y
> Folder "testing" in <Mail> doesn't exist. Create? y
>
> [Folder created]
>
> Problem detected: "Received abort signal".
> Pine Exiting.
>
> -----
> Jessie Kleefstra E-Mail: [email protected]
> Sr. Consultant, Helpdesk Services Phone: (905) 525-9140 ext. 24357
> Computing & Information Services Fax: (905) 528-3773
> ABB-132
> McMaster University
>
> --
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> For information about this mailing list, and its archives, see:
> http://www.washington.edu/pine/pine-info/
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>

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From: Vasantha Narayanan <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: pine.conf location
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Hi,

By default, pine assumes that the pine.conf file will be in
/usr/local/lib/pine.conf. How do we make pine look at a different
pine.conf file?

I've a situation where I've to run two versions of pine. One that looks at
/var/mail on the system itself and another which is a pop version that
points to the popper. For both these pines to work simultaneously on the
same system, I've to have each of these pine binaries refer to a different
pine.conf file. I'm aware that the users can change their pinerc file
themselves. But I want to globally control it so that if a user just types
pine, it checks the local /var/mail. If they type, "pinepop" or some such,
it points to the popper. To acheive this could someone please tell me what
i need to change before I run a build for pine?

Thanks much.

Vasantha

VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
Vasantha Narayanan
Networking and Systems email: [email protected]
Haverford College, PA Phone: 610-896-1110

--
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From [email protected] Mon Jun 4 13:25:48 2001 -0700
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From: Vasantha Narayanan <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: pine.conf location
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Never mind my question. I was able to figure it out. For those who might
be interested, the solution is to go to the osdep directory and find the
appropriate os-whatever.h file and edit the definitions of SYSTEM_PINERC
and the SYSTEM_PINERC_FIXED. You have to run a build after making the change.

Vasantha

At 12:07 PM 6/4/01 -0400, Vasantha Narayanan wrote:
>Hi,
>
>By default, pine assumes that the pine.conf file will be in
>/usr/local/lib/pine.conf. How do we make pine look at a different
>pine.conf file?
>
>I've a situation where I've to run two versions of pine. One that looks at
>/var/mail on the system itself and another which is a pop version that
>points to the popper. For both these pines to work simultaneously on the
>same system, I've to have each of these pine binaries refer to a different
>pine.conf file. I'm aware that the users can change their pinerc file
>themselves. But I want to globally control it so that if a user just types
>pine, it checks the local /var/mail. If they type, "pinepop" or some such,
>it points to the popper. To acheive this could someone please tell me what
>i need to change before I run a build for pine?
>
>Thanks much.
>
>Vasantha
>
>VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
>Vasantha Narayanan
>Networking and Systems email: [email protected]
>Haverford College, PA Phone: 610-896-1110
>
>
>--
>-----------------------------------------------------------------
> For information about this mailing list, and its archives, see:
> http://www.washington.edu/pine/pine-info/
>-----------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
Vasantha Narayanan
Networking and Systems email: [email protected]
Haverford College, PA Phone: 610-896-1110

From [email protected] Mon Jun 4 13:58:57 2001 -0700
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From: Eduardo Chappa <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: pine.conf location
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*** Vasantha Narayanan ([email protected]) wrote in the pine-info list...:

:) I've a situation where I've to run two versions of pine. One that looks
:) at /var/mail on the system itself and another which is a pop version
:) that points to the popper. For both these pines to work simultaneously
:) on the same system, I've to have each of these pine binaries refer to a
:) different pine.conf file. I'm aware that the users can change their
:) pinerc file themselves. But I want to globally control it so that if a
:) user just types pine, it checks the local /var/mail. If they type,
:) "pinepop" or some such, it points to the popper. To acheive this could
:) someone please tell me what i need to change before I run a build for
:) pine?

Wouldn't it be easier to just define pine to be

pine -inbox-path="/var/mail/$LOGNAME"

and pinepop to be

pine -inbox-path="{name.pop.server/pop3/user=$LOGNAME}"

--
Eduardo
http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/

From [email protected] Tue Jun 5 18:46:22 2001 -0700
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From: "Michael D. Walker" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: pine.conf location
In-Reply-To: <Pine.EDO.4.33.0106041351300.266399-100000@goedel3.math.washington.edu>
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On Mon, 4 Jun 2001, Eduardo Chappa wrote:

>*** Vasantha Narayanan ([email protected]) wrote in the pine-info list...:
>
>:) I've a situation where I've to run two versions of pine. One that looks
>:) at /var/mail on the system itself and another which is a pop version
>:) that points to the popper. For both these pines to work simultaneously
>:) on the same system, I've to have each of these pine binaries refer to a
>:) different pine.conf file. I'm aware that the users can change their
>:) pinerc file themselves. But I want to globally control it so that if a
>:) user just types pine, it checks the local /var/mail. If they type,
>:) "pinepop" or some such, it points to the popper. To acheive this could
>:) someone please tell me what i need to change before I run a build for
>:) pine?
>
>Wouldn't it be easier to just define pine to be
>
>pine -inbox-path="/var/mail/$LOGNAME"
>
>and pinepop to be
>
>pine -inbox-path="{name.pop.server/pop3/user=$LOGNAME}"

and a PINEHOME environment variable for the pine.conf file
and MAIL for the inbox itself.

>--
>Eduardo
>http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/
>

From [email protected] Tue Jun 5 19:02:31 2001 -0700
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From: Mark Crispin <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: re: Marking message for deletion in POP3
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On Tue, 5 Jun 2001 17:20:19 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
> Could someone let me know how to mark messages for
> deletion in POP3 ? I want to mark them deleted and expunge all
> the deleted messages at once. There is no api in pop3.h of c-client
> library for this.

The only way to delete messages in the POP3 protocol is to issue DELE commands
and then to issue a QUIT to confirm. If a QUIT is not issued, the POP3 server
forgets about the DELE commands.

Since the c-client API has the delete-expunge model with an undelete permitted
prior to expunge, the way this is implemented in c-client is to set the
\Deleted flag, then call mail_expunge() to send the DELE commands. At this
point, you can no longer undelete and the messages become unavailable to c-
client; however of course the true purge at the server happens at mail_close()
time. Although this seems strange, it's the only way to get IMAP like
behavior, which is what the c-client API tries to provide, from POP.

From [email protected] Wed Jun 6 19:11:41 2001 -0700
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From: Matt Ackeret <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: not putting cursor back after a message is shown
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Hmm, I didn't realize pine still printed out messages while I was in my
external editor (vim)..

But it does, and I was editing a message, and got a message about
a message being filtered..

The cursor was left at the lower left of the screen, not where I was expecting
to type.

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From: "J. W. Ballantine" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: pine with mh style mail folders
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I'm trying to use pine with mh style folders, and I run into a brick wall
on the inbox/INBOX issue. My mh folders include a folder named inbox (lc)
where I keep my misc incoming mail. When I start pine in looks at INBOX
and uses the system default as a file, ie no [/].

Is there someway to use/access my mh inbox inplace of/or in addition to
the system default??

Thanks
Jim

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From [email protected] Thu Jun 7 08:38:49 2001 -0700
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From: Jacob Morzinski <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: pine with mh style mail folders
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On Thu, 7 Jun 2001, J. W. Ballantine wrote:
> Is there someway to use/access my mh inbox inplace of/or in addition to
> the system default??

The special name #mh should direct pine into your MH folders.
Try opening the folder #mh/inbox.

--
Jacob Morzinski [email protected]

From [email protected] Thu Jun 7 08:58:22 2001 -0700
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From: "J. W. Ballantine" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: pine with mh style mail folders
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 07 Jun 2001 11:37:12 EDT."
<[email protected]>
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I would if I could, but the only inbox folder that shows up when I list folders
is INBOX, there is no inbox[/].

---------- In Response to your message -------------

> Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 11:37:12 -0400 (EDT)
> To: "J. W. Ballantine" <[email protected]>
> From: Jacob Morzinski <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: pine with mh style mail folders
>
> On Thu, 7 Jun 2001, J. W. Ballantine wrote:
> > Is there someway to use/access my mh inbox inplace of/or in addition to
> > the system default??
>
> The special name #mh should direct pine into your MH folders.
> Try opening the folder #mh/inbox.
>
> --
> Jacob Morzinski [email protected]
>
>

From [email protected] Thu Jun 7 09:05:10 2001 -0700
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From: <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Changing "From" header
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I am having a problem with Pine after changing my from address using
Roles (this is the method which has been suggested here before). The
address is changed correctly, but the copy of the mail stored in my sent
messages is not recognized as being from me. Before changing the address,
all mail in my sent messages folder would automatically display the "To"
address and now it always shows the "From" address (my address).

Both addresses are aliased to the same account, the new address is more
readable and easy to remember so I prefer to have this as my From address.
Is there any way I can have Pine recognize this as being sent mail and not
received mail? I am using Pine 4.33 on a Unix system.

Thanks

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From: "Aaron S. Hawley" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Changing "From" header
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9.4 Why does my message index show From: instead of To:?
http://www.washington.edu/pine/faq/config.html#9.4

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From [email protected] Thu Jun 7 09:14:57 2001 -0700
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From: Joel Boonstra <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Changing "From" header
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.33.0106071101350.16011-100000@diablo3>
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> I am having a problem with Pine after changing my from address using
> Roles (this is the method which has been suggested here before). The
> address is changed correctly, but the copy of the mail stored in my sent
> messages is not recognized as being from me. Before changing the address,
> all mail in my sent messages folder would automatically display the "To"
> address and now it always shows the "From" address (my address).
>
> Both addresses are aliased to the same account, the new address is more
> readable and easy to remember so I prefer to have this as my From address.
> Is there any way I can have Pine recognize this as being sent mail and not
> received mail? I am using Pine 4.33 on a Unix system.

Sure, this is easy to do. Just add the new address (the one that your
'From' lines are set to) to the 'alt-addresses' section in the pine
config. Those are additional addresses that pine recognizes as being
yours.

HTH!

--
Joel Boonstra
[email protected]

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From: [email protected]
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: LOGIN in POP3
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Hi,

This is regarding login phase in POP3. After I do pop3_open,
I need to login to the mailbox. For this I need to pass the USER
and the PASS values. I understand that the pop3_auth() gets these
values by calling mm_login() and passes those values thru
pop3_send (stream,"USER",usr) and pop3_send (stream,"PASS",tmp)
commands. In my program I just hardcoded these values in the mm_login
function. My question is how do I pass/set these values(user name and
passowrd)
from my function so that its taken during pop3_auth for login.

Thanks,
Manjula

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From: Mark Crispin <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: re: LOGIN in POP3
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It should suffice to hard code them in mm_login(). Note that c-client passes
buffers, so you have to do something like
strcpy (user,"fred");
strcpy (password,"sesame");
instead of
user = "fred";
password = "sesame";

On Thu, 7 Jun 2001 11:14:57 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
> This is regarding login phase in POP3. After I do pop3_open,
> I need to login to the mailbox. For this I need to pass the USER
> and the PASS values. I understand that the pop3_auth() gets these
> values by calling mm_login() and passes those values thru
> pop3_send (stream,"USER",usr) and pop3_send (stream,"PASS",tmp)
> commands. In my program I just hardcoded these values in the mm_login
> function. My question is how do I pass/set these values(user name and
> passowrd)
> from my function so that its taken during pop3_auth for login.

From [email protected] Sun ??? 0 00:00:00 1970 +0000
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From: "bob -" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: how to change where inbox is?
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hello

can someone please tell me how to change where the incoming mail is stored. currently it is in /var/spool/mail/$USER, but i want to change it to /home/$USER/mail.

thanks

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From: "Mike A. Harris" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Bug in PINE with large messages?
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I have a message in a folder that is 1.2Mb of raw text. Actually
it is a mail folder from GNU mailman mailing list archive, I
downloaded and plopped in my PINE dir. Instead of it appearing
as a group of messages, it shows up as one 1.2Mb message.

PINE lets me view it ok, but it says the folder is read only and
will not let me delete the folder, the message, etc. There is
nothing else reading/writing this file. It has the same
ownership and permissions as all other mail folders, and other
programs can read the file just fine. I loaded it in joe and
added a single char and saved it no problem.

gzipped file avail on request.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike A. Harris Shipping/mailing address:
OS Systems Engineer 190 Pittsburgh Ave., Sault Ste. Marie,
Red Hat Inc. Ontario, Canada, P6C 5B3
http://www.redhat.com Phone: (705)949-2136
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From: Erik <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Pine address book.. remapping..
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In the "nickname" portion of the address book, you can't include @
symbols.. Is there a way to disable that?

I'd like to be able to put entries in for common address that I e-mail,
that get sent to the wrong place.. like:

[email protected]

so when i put that in, it checks the address book, and finds that
nickname, and maps it out to:

Friend <[email protected]>

Erik

"Security is a process, not a product."

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From: "Jack Tripper" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Getting Mail Attachments From Pine
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My CS class submits all of their C++ Coding assignments via email
attachments and I have been trying to write a simple shell script or quick C
hack to dump all of their attachments to a directory. I have perused through
some of the pine source and I hope I don't offend anyone when I say it's
pretty ugly. Is there an easy way to accomplish this task?

Thanks A lot,
-Rob
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

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And it came to pass that Today, at 5:38pm, Jack Tripper said:

>My CS class submits all of their C++ Coding assignments via email
>attachments and I have been trying to write a simple shell script or quick C
>hack to dump all of their attachments to a directory. I have perused through
>some of the pine source and I hope I don't offend anyone when I say it's
>pretty ugly. Is there an easy way to accomplish this task?

FreeBSD has a port available for a program called RipMIME that can do this.
I've never used it, but here's what it claims:

"RipMIME has been written with one sole purpose in mind, to extract the
attached files out of a MIME encoded email package."

You can probably find more info at:
http://www.pldaniels.com/ripmime

Hope that helps,
Mac

--
Mac Newbold Univ. of Utah Computer Science Dept.
[email protected] http://www.cs.utah.edu/~newbold/

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From: "Mike A. Harris" <[email protected]>
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Subject: Re: Getting Mail Attachments From Pine
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On Fri, 8 Jun 2001, Jack Tripper wrote:

>Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 17:38:30 -0400
>From: Jack Tripper <[email protected]>
>To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
>Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>Subject: Getting Mail Attachments From Pine
>
>My CS class submits all of their C++ Coding assignments via email
>attachments and I have been trying to write a simple shell script or quick C
>hack to dump all of their attachments to a directory. I have perused through
>some of the pine source and I hope I don't offend anyone when I say it's
>pretty ugly. Is there an easy way to accomplish this task?

procmail is what you need. Try:

man procmail
man procmailrc
man procmailex
man formail

It is not easy reading if you're new to procmail and/or regular
expressions, but the manpages list a mailing list that can help
you, and it is quite good. You'll have to be careful when you
use it to make sure that it isn't DoS'able or exploitable
remotely. Check file attachment sizes, and avail disk space.

Hope this helps,
TTYL

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike A. Harris Shipping/mailing address:
OS Systems Engineer 190 Pittsburgh Ave., Sault Ste. Marie,
Red Hat Inc. Ontario, Canada, P6C 5B3
http://www.redhat.com Phone: (705)949-2136
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Point of execution:
I postponed three messages since I wanted to send them all
together over a dial out connection. Then I selected the postponed folder
just to consume some (personal) time and left it again as I could not
figure out what I wanted there but sending the messages. So I selected
Compose again to send the messages now. When I press ^X to send the pine
exits with an abort signal

next comes the debug output:

Debug output of the Pine program (debug=2 debug_imap=0). Version 4.33
Sat Jun 9 09:22:10 2001

[ ... ]

---- MAIL INDEX ----

---- INDEX MANAGER ----
MAIL_CMD: going to folder/collection menu
=== folder_screen called ====

---- FOLDER LISTER ----
About to open folder "postponed-msgs" inbox: "INBOX"
expunge and close mail stream "/home/ingo/mail/Vim Develop"
Opened folder "/home/ingo/mail/postponed-msgs" with 3 messages
process_filter_patterns
Sorting by Date

---- MAIL INDEX ----

---- INDEX MANAGER ----
MAIL_CMD: going to folder/collection menu
=== folder_screen called ====

---- FOLDER LISTER ----

---- COMPOSE SCREEN (not in pico yet) ----
Want_to read: y (121)
done.
IMAP 10:04:36 6/9 mm_log babble: Expunged 1 messages

=== send called ===
about to end_tty_driver
Pine Panic: Received abort signal

=============================================================================
The message was lost !!!

CU INGO

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How can I have in a single domain :
1. Lotus Notes server for some users
2. Pine Server for some - acting as receipient for all incoming =
mails & gateway for outgoing mails from Pine users & Lotus Notes users.
Regards,
Sankar Chakrabarti
IBM Global Services India (P) Ltd.
Location : TISCO - Tubes Division
Contact No : 9835117541,0657-227677/228798
Email : [email protected]

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4134.100" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DVerdana size=3D2>How can I have in a single domain =
:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DVerdana size=3D2>    1. Lotus Notes =
server for some=20
users</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DVerdana size=3D2>    2. Pine Server for =
some -=20
acting as receipient for all incoming mails & gateway for outgoing =
mails=20
from Pine users & Lotus Notes users.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DVerdana size=3D2>Regards,<BR>Sankar Chakrabarti<BR>IBM =
Global=20
Services India (P) Ltd.<BR>Location : TISCO - Tubes Division<BR>Contact =
No :=20
9835117541,0657-227677/228798<BR>Email : <A=20
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</A>=
</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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A friend accesses his messages in two ways: connecting to an IMAP server
using PC-Pine and also connecting to his Unix shell and accessing his
messages on the shell using Pine 4.33.
(In Windows, he uses PC-Pine 4.33.)
The problem is that when he uses PC-Pine, the messages he receives are no
longer available to him when using the Unix shell.
After he logs into the server, Unless deleted, they're displayed in
PC-pine until he deletes them, and new messages are added to the index,
but again inaccessible from the shell.
At least on the accounts I use, I've never seen this behavior using either
IMAP or POP.
It's as if something happens in PC-Pine which hides the messages from view
to Unix Pine, although that sounds silly.
I thought it might have something to do with folder states, so had him
uncheck quell-internal-folder-message in both Pine and PC-Pine, but the
behavior still continues.
Can anybody point me to either a solution to this problem, or some good
places to check?
Or might this be some mis-programming of IMAP on the provider's end?
--Rick

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From: "Nick Birkett (x8289)" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: New data and methods for Infection Transmission System Analysis (fwd)
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This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text,
while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools.
Send mail to [email protected] for more info.

------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C0F1ED.88EB0260
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=iso-8859-1
Content-ID: <[email protected]>

THe message attached to this message isn't relevent to this group but it
illustrates my problem/question. I received the message as a regular
readable message (ie not as an attachement). However, when I try to
forward it to another person, it gets convereted to an attachment. This
is happening a lot lately.

CAn anyone explain why and tell me if I can do anything at my end to make
pine send out the message as a regular message rather than an attachment?

Thanks.

========================================================================
Nicholas Birkett, M.D., M.Sc.
Epidemiology and Community Medicine
University of Ottawa [email protected]
451 Smyth Rd., (613)-562-5800 x 8289 (voice)
Ottawa, Ontario, (613)-562-5465 (fax)
Canada. K1H 8M5
=========================================================================

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 20:40:07 -0400
From: James Koopman <[email protected]>
To: Mark Becker <[email protected]>, Brian Burt <[email protected]>,
Don Burke <[email protected]>,
"Margaret L. Brandeau" <[email protected]>,
Philip Brachman <[email protected]>,
Matthew Boulton <[email protected]>,
"Barry R. Bloom" <[email protected]>,
Sally Blower <[email protected]>,
nick birkett <[email protected]>,
"Roger A. Bielefeld" <[email protected]>,
"Dr. Leonelo E. Bautista" <[email protected]>,
Dan Barth-Jones <[email protected]>,
Frank G Ball <[email protected]>,
Joan Aron <JARON%[email protected]>,
Sevgi Aral <[email protected]>,
Roy Anderson <[email protected]>,
Michael Altman <[email protected]>,
Naomar Almeida Filho <[email protected]>,
Roel Bakker <[email protected]>, Niels Becker <[email protected]>
Subject: New data and methods for Infection Transmission System Analysis

Colleagues;
It is known that the system aspects of how infection is spread through
a population are dominant determinants of population infection levels and
offer many opportunities for infection control the epidemiologists commonly
miss when they use standard individual risk based methods. But one reason
transmission system analysis has not taken hold is that the data for such an
analysis are hard to come by. We have recently made advances that provide a
powerful new source of data. I will present these at the Congress next
Friday. The issue I will use to present our new approach will by how to
assess the benefits of focusing control efforts on high risk groups. I will
first show that the standard epidemiological data determining individual
risks by risk group status provide little information on on potential
intervention effects and that attributable risk and individual risk causal
model approaches are intrinsically deceptive. For example, given a 15% rate
in a high risk group and a 3% risk in the remaining population, the effect
of interventions can vary 80 fold depending upon contact patterns. The
trick is to determine what are the underlying contact patterns that give
rise to the observed infection frequencies. I will present a neat way of
performing that trick using nucleotide sequences from agents isolated from
individuals in both risk groups at two time points.

I would very much like for anyone to attend who has an interest on
population effects independent of individual effects and/or epidemiological
methodology for the study of populations as integrated entities rather than
as collections of independent individuals.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jim Koopman MD MPH Phone (734) 763-5629 office
Dept. of Epidemiology SPH-1 (734) 995-2954 home
109 Observatory St. Fax (734) 764-3192
Ann Arbor, MI 48109 e-mail [email protected]
http://www.sph.umich.edu/~jkoopman/jkoopman.html
Developing Theory that Serves the Public Health
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C0F1ED.88EB0260
Content-Type: TEXT/HTML; CHARSET=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE
Content-ID: <[email protected]>
Content-Description:

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.3018.900" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Colleagues;<BR>     =
It is known=20
that the system aspects of how infection is spread through<BR>a =
population are=20
dominant determinants of population infection levels and<BR>offer many=20
opportunities for infection control the epidemiologists commonly<BR>miss =
when=20
they use standard individual risk based methods.  But one=20
reason<BR>transmission system analysis has not taken hold is that the =
data for=20
such an<BR>analysis are hard to come by.  We have recently made =
advances=20
that provide a<BR>powerful new source of data.  I will present =
these at the=20
Congress next<BR>Friday.  The issue I will use to present our new =
approach=20
will by how to<BR>assess the benefits of focusing control efforts on =
high risk=20
groups.  I will<BR>first show that the standard epidemiological =
data=20
determining individual<BR>risks by risk group status provide little =
information=20
on on potential<BR>intervention effects and that attributable risk and=20
individual risk causal<BR>model approaches are intrinsically =
deceptive. =20
For example, given a 15% rate<BR>in a high risk group and a 3% risk in =
the=20
remaining population, the effect<BR>of interventions can vary 80 fold =
depending=20
upon contact patterns.  The<BR>trick is to determine what are the=20
underlying contact patterns that give<BR>rise to the observed infection=20
frequencies.  I will present a neat way of<BR>performing that trick =
using=20
nucleotide sequences from agents isolated from<BR>individuals in both =
risk=20
groups at two time points.<BR><BR>     I would very =
much=20
like for anyone to attend who has an interest on<BR>population effects=20
independent of individual effects and/or epidemiological<BR>methodology =
for the=20
study of populations as integrated entities rather than<BR>as =
collections of=20
independent individuals.<BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>----------------------------------------------------------------=
-------<BR>Jim=20
Koopman MD=20
MPH           &nbs=
p;         =20
Phone (734) 763-5629 office<BR>Dept. of Epidemiology=20
SPH-1           &n=
bsp;      =20
(734) 995-2954 home<BR>109 Observatory=20
St.           &nbs=
p;        =20
Fax   (734) 764-3192<BR>Ann Arbor, MI=20
48109           &n=
bsp;        =20
e-mail  <A =
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</A>=20
<BR>          <A=20
href=3D"http://www.sph.umich.edu/~jkoopman/jkoopman.html">http://www.sph.=
umich.edu/~jkoopman/jkoopman.html</A><BR>     &n=
bsp;    =20
Developing Theory that Serves the Public=20
Health           &=
nbsp;    =20
<BR>---------------------------------------------------------------------=
--</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C0F1ED.88EB0260--

From [email protected] Sun ??? 0 00:00:00 1970 +0000
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From: Anil <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: unable to save messages
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i'm unable to save copies of outgoing messages which usually go into my
sent-mail folder by default. in fact, the new sent-mail folder is not
being able to be created due to some disk quota being exceeded, which my
e-mail provider insists is not an issue, since i have ample disk space.

i'm not very technical, so any help would be highly appreciated. right
now, i'm saving copies of outgoing mails by cc:ing myself and keeping it
in my inbox, which is a cumbersome solution indeed :-).

thanks a ton.
anil

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From: Eduardo Chappa <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: New data and methods for Infection Transmission System Analysis
(fwd)
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*** Nick Birkett (x8289) ([email protected]) wrote in the...:

:) THe message attached to this message isn't relevent to this group but it
:) illustrates my problem/question. I received the message as a regular
:) readable message (ie not as an attachement). However, when I try to
:) forward it to another person, it gets convereted to an attachment. This
:) is happening a lot lately.
:)
:) CAn anyone explain why and tell me if I can do anything at my end to make
:) pine send out the message as a regular message rather than an attachment?

Pine 3.95 does not speak html, so the Pine team decided that just
displaying the text was not a good idea, since it is not text/plain. You
need to upgrade to 4.33, where I do not see any problem or ask the people
that send you e-mail messages not to send you html messages.

Another possible suggestion is to try to see if display-filters can be
used to start lynx, so that html attachments (or messages) be processed by
lynx and converted to text/plain, where you should not have any problem to
forward them as text and not as an attachment.

--
Eduardo
http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/

From [email protected] Sun ??? 0 00:00:00 1970 +0000
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From: Marci Burgess <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: alt-addresses issue
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I'm running Pine 4.21 on AIX 4.3.3, and I have several users with access
to a common .mbx mailbox

In order for the users to see to whom each message has been sent (in
sent-mail), I have included each of their individual e-mail addresses
under alt-addresses of the .mbx mailbox

With this change, I believe that Pine sees each user as the same
person; thus, in the inbox, the "+" symbol appears next to every message
which is a reply. Before, when user xyz logged in, she saw the "+" next
to only those messages which were replying to her.

Is there any way around this? Is there a way for the sent-mail box to
display to whom the message was sent without having to use the
alt-addresses option?

Thanks for any help you can give!

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From: "Jack Tripper" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Getting Mail Attachments From Pine
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I downloaded and compiled ripMime, but how do I get the mail files in MIME
format from pine(I know very little about mailing systems, especially pine).

Thanks guys,
-Rob

>From: Mac Newbold <[email protected]>
>To: Jack Tripper <[email protected]>
>CC: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
>Subject: Re: Getting Mail Attachments From Pine
>Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 15:53:54 -0600 (MDT)
>
>And it came to pass that Today, at 5:38pm, Jack Tripper said:
>
> >My CS class submits all of their C++ Coding assignments via email
> >attachments and I have been trying to write a simple shell script or
>quick C
> >hack to dump all of their attachments to a directory. I have perused
>through
> >some of the pine source and I hope I don't offend anyone when I say it's
> >pretty ugly. Is there an easy way to accomplish this task?
>
>FreeBSD has a port available for a program called RipMIME that can do this.
>I've never used it, but here's what it claims:
>
>"RipMIME has been written with one sole purpose in mind, to extract the
>attached files out of a MIME encoded email package."
>
>You can probably find more info at:
>http://www.pldaniels.com/ripmime
>
>Hope that helps,
>Mac
>
>--
>Mac Newbold Univ. of Utah Computer Science Dept.
>[email protected] http://www.cs.utah.edu/~newbold/
>

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

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From: Emil Isberg <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: alt-addresses issue
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On Mon, 11 Jun 2001, Marci Burgess wrote:
>I'm running Pine 4.21 on AIX 4.3.3, and I have several users with access
>to a common .mbx mailbox
>
>In order for the users to see to whom each message has been sent (in
>sent-mail), I have included each of their individual e-mail addresses
>under alt-addresses of the .mbx mailbox

With at least 4.33 there is an option index-format that might do a better
job than adding those adresses under alt-adresses.

Default for index-format is:
index-format=3DSTATUS=A0MSGNO=A0DATE=A0FROMORTO(33%)=A0SIZE=A0SUBJECT(67%=
)
And I suggest you set it to:
index-format=3DSTATUS=A0MSGNO=A0DATE=A0TO(33%)=A0SIZE=A0SUBJECT(67%)

Or something like that... :-)

--=20
The rain it raineth on the just
And also on the unjust fella:
But chiefly on the just, because
The unjust steals the just's umbrella.
=09=09-- Lord Bowen

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From: Joel Boonstra <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: alt-addresses issue
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> I'm running Pine 4.21 on AIX 4.3.3, and I have several users with access
> to a common .mbx mailbox
>
> In order for the users to see to whom each message has been sent (in
> sent-mail), I have included each of their individual e-mail addresses
> under alt-addresses of the .mbx mailbox
>
> With this change, I believe that Pine sees each user as the same
> person; thus, in the inbox, the "+" symbol appears next to every message
> which is a reply. Before, when user xyz logged in, she saw the "+" next
> to only those messages which were replying to her.
>
> Is there any way around this? Is there a way for the sent-mail box to
> display to whom the message was sent without having to use the
> alt-addresses option?
>
> Thanks for any help you can give!

You're going to want to look at the 'index-format' section in the pine
config file. It contains tokens that describe exactly how you would like
your index line to appear. The default setting seems to use a token
called 'FROMORTO', which displays the 'From:' header if it's not in the
alt-addresses listing, or the 'To:' if the from isn't displayed. You can
use just the 'FROM' token, which ignores the 'To:' header.

Note that if you play with the 'index-format' option, you need to specify
exactly how the index line will appear - that is, you can't just change
'FROMORTO' to 'FROM'. The helpfile in pine includes a list of all the
possible tokens (there's a lot of 'em!).

HTH!

--
Joel Boonstra
[email protected]

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From: Joel Boonstra <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Feature Request: select by thread
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Hello,

Please forgive me if this feature exists already and I'm missing it.

It would be nice to have 'tHread' available in the aggregate-command set,
when selecting by text. As things are right now (4.33 on Linux), to get
all the messages in a thread, I have to select by subject (;ts), capture
the current subject (^X), then edit that subject to strip out any 'Re:' or
'(fwd)', or anything else. I've found that 'CTRL+<SPACE>' comes in handy
here, to advance by a word (i.e., get rid of the 'RE: '), but it's still
quite cumbersome.

Is this currently possible? If not, would it be possible to add it? I
suppose I could look at the code myself and see...

I have found this patch:

http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/info/kolapse.html

which would be wonderful. However, it only seems to be available for
<= 4.32, and I can't downgrade for certain reasons. Any suggestions would
be most welcome.

--
Joel Boonstra
[email protected]

--
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From: Mac Newbold <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Getting Mail Attachments From Pine
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And it came to pass that Today, at 3:14pm, Jack Tripper said:

>I downloaded and compiled ripMime, but how do I get the mail files in MIME
>format from pine(I know very little about mailing systems, especially pine).

IIRC, ripMime works on whole mailboxes, so you can just save all the messages
with the attachments to a local folder, then use ripMime on the file
containing the mail folder. It will be found in your mail directory (usually
~/mail, or ~/.mail). I don't know if ripMime modifies the actual mailbox, so
you might want to try it out on a copy of the file.

Mac

--
Mac Newbold Univ. of Utah Computer Science Dept.
[email protected] http://www.cs.utah.edu/~newbold/

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From: Eduardo Chappa <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: alt-addresses issue
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*** Marci Burgess ([email protected]) wrote in the pine-info list today:

:) I'm running Pine 4.21 on AIX 4.3.3, and I have several users with
:) access to a common .mbx mailbox
:)
:) In order for the users to see to whom each message has been sent (in
:) sent-mail), I have included each of their individual e-mail addresses
:) under alt-addresses of the .mbx mailbox
:)
:) With this change, I believe that Pine sees each user as the same
:) person; thus, in the inbox, the "+" symbol appears next to every
:) message which is a reply. Before, when user xyz logged in, she saw the
:) "+" next to only those messages which were replying to her.
:)
:) Is there any way around this? Is there a way for the sent-mail box to
:) display to whom the message was sent without having to use the
:) alt-addresses option?

There's no really satisfactory way of doing this, the closest that I can
think of is to have an extra column in the index, one indicating the FROM
field, and another indicating the TO field.

You can also apply a patch that I wrote called "Define your own rules..."
which among other things allows you to do this. If you are interested in
this grab the patch from my web site (address below) or contact me
directly, as it's a little bit long to explain everything here, and really
easy to make it work.

--
Eduardo
http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/

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From: "Ed Greshko" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: pine on a diet
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Hi,

This is just a bit of FYI....

I'm using the Sun "WorkShop Compilers 5.0" to compile pine. I tweaked the
various makefiles and other places to compile pine without debugging turned on
as well as increasing the level of optimization. I also "stripped" the
binaries.

After this the pine binary went from 6079276 to 5001928. Also, the imap
binary went from 4833280 to 2013220. This was on a Solaris 7 system. Yes,
the compile took longer.

Results were even better on a Solaris 8 machine.

Regards,
Ed

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From: "Bill Andersen" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Nav Problem
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Hello All...

I'm locked in to using an older system and have finally
managed to get Pine working. The system is AIX 4.1.5.0
and Pine is 4.10.

Everything is working well, but I've run across a small
problem with my Wyse50 terminals. I use a PC and terminal
emulator to telnet to the AIX machine. My term is set
to vt100 and my arrow keys will allow me to move the
highlight bar between options. I was at one of my user's
terminals yesterday and they were using "N" for next and
"P" for previous (which is fine), but as a habit, they
hit an arrow key to move around and got an error. The
arrow keys are not functioning correctly in Pine. They
work fine in our accounting software, so I've got to
believe the terminal def is correct.

Is there something in Pine 4.10 that would prevent "wyse50"
TERM "type" from working correctly. Or is there a setting
I'm missing in Pine?

Not a real big thing, but I'd have some happy users if
anyone can direct me to some info/FAQ on the matter...

Thanks

Bill

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From: Bob Rasmussen <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Viewing via .mailcap
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With Pine on Unix, it is possible to configure viewers for various
kinds of attachments, using the .mailcap file. So far so good. I can make food
use of this, as long as the attachment (as built by the sender's mail
software) includes a MIME type.

However, if the MIME type indicates only that it is
"Application/OCTET-STREAM", then I would like to have access to the original
filename's extension. There does not appear to be a way to do this. I have
looked at the source, although not the very latest.

Can someone confirm this, or provide a workaround?

Regards,
...Bob Rasmussen, President, Rasmussen Software, Inc.

personal e-mail: [email protected]
company e-mail: [email protected]
voice: (US) 503-624-0360 (9:00-6:00 Pacific Time)
fax: (US) 503-624-0760
web: http://www.anzio.com

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From: "Sankar Chakrabarti" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Disk Quota
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Can I implement Disk Quota for users mails (/var/spool/mail) in pine ??
Regards,
Sankar Chakrabarti
IBM Global Services India (P) Ltd.
Location : TISCO - Tubes Division
Contact No : 9835117541,0657-227677/228798
Email : [email protected]

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
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charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4134.100" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DVerdana size=3D2>Can I implement Disk Quota for users =
mails=20
(/var/spool/mail) in pine ??</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DVerdana size=3D2>Regards,<BR>Sankar Chakrabarti<BR>IBM =
Global=20
Services India (P) Ltd.<BR>Location : TISCO - Tubes Division<BR>Contact =
No :=20
9835117541,0657-227677/228798<BR>Email : <A=20
href=3D"mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</A>=
</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From: "Mike A. Harris" <[email protected]>
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Subject: Re: Disk Quota
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On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Sankar Chakrabarti wrote:

>Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 11:24:39 +0530
>From: Sankar Chakrabarti <[email protected]>
>To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
>Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
> boundary="----=_NextPart_000_010E_01C0F58D.C4386D00"
>Subject: Disk Quota
>
>Can I implement Disk Quota for users mails (/var/spool/mail) in pine ??

Disk quotas is a feature (or not) of your operating system. PINE
is not involved in that. In Red Hat Linux you can configure disk
quotas using linuxconf.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike A. Harris Shipping/mailing address:
OS Systems Engineer 190 Pittsburgh Ave., Sault Ste. Marie,
Red Hat Inc. Ontario, Canada, P6C 5B3
http://www.redhat.com Phone: (705)949-2136
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Latest XFree86 test RPMS: ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris/testing

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From: Chris Drumgoole <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: compiling on HP/UX 11: error 1711
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Hello,

I am trying to compile pine 4.33 on an HP/UX 11 machine, using the HP cc
compiler, so I use:

/build hpp (as hpx is for hpux 10, right?)

It builds c-client, imapd, pilot, and pico fine, however, during the pine
build, I get this:

cc -g -DDEBUG -DCAEN -Dconst= -Aa -D_HPUX_SOURCE -DHPP -DSYSTYPE=\"HPP\"
-DMOUSE -c os.c cc: "os.c", line 1285: error 1711: Inconsistent parameter
list declaration for "srandom". *** Error exit code 1A

I looked in the os.c (os-hpp.c), and this is the srandom function:
void
srandom(i)
int i;
{
}

Any ideas?

Not sure if this helps, but it builds fine on other platforms (solaris,
being one of them).

thanks for your help in advance.

chris

<q

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From: Chris Drumgoole <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: compiling on HP/UX 11: error 1711 (working now)
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OK, apparently, using ./build hpx works. I apologize for the previous
message. The comments in the makefile.hpx say it is for HP/UX 10 system,
specifically... that is why I was confused.

chris

<q

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From: Gregoire Welraeds <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: outlook and pine message.
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Hello,

this is my first post to this list. I have question about a problem between
pine and M$ outlook/outlook express. here is the question:

I recieve a mail from an outlook user.
I reply to the message using Pine
=> Outlook user recieve the entire mail as an attachment. The body of the mail
is empty.

I'm using PINE 4.10 on a Linux SuSE 6.1,but I know I had the same problem with
previous/same versions of PINE under FreeBSD 3.2 and 4.1.

Is there anything that I can do to correct this behaviour ? Is it a coding
issue ? I have searched in the archive of this mailling but I haven't found
anything regarding this issue. I don't know if this is a common question but if
it is, than just forgive me.

Gregoire Welraeds

<gregoire (at) welraeds (dot) be>

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From: Joel Boonstra <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: outlook and pine message.
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Gregorie,

> this is my first post to this list. I have question about a problem between
> pine and M$ outlook/outlook express. here is the question:
>
> I recieve a mail from an outlook user.
> I reply to the message using Pine
> => Outlook user recieve the entire mail as an attachment. The body of the mail
> is empty.
>
> I'm using PINE 4.10 on a Linux SuSE 6.1,but I know I had the same problem with
> previous/same versions of PINE under FreeBSD 3.2 and 4.1.
>
> Is there anything that I can do to correct this behaviour ? Is it a
> coding issue ? I have searched in the archive of this mailling but I
> haven't found anything regarding this issue. I don't know if this is a
> common question but if it is, than just forgive me.

Does this happen with all Outlook users that you send email to, or just
some? Can you upgrade to a newer version of Pine, or isn't that possible?

It sounds like this may be a Character-set discrepancy. I have
experienced similar issues using Pine to send email to Outlook users, and
the solution was to change my character-set from nothing to 'ISO-8859-1'.
I don't know which one you'd be using, but that may be one thing you can
try. I've found that if you don't specify a character-set in your Pine
config, then send messages that include accented or other special
characters, some users receive your message as type 'X-UNKNOWN', and
display it as an attachment.

HTH!

--
Joel Boonstra
[email protected]

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From: Gregoire Welraeds <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: outlook and pine message.
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On Sun, 17 Jun 2001, Joel Boonstra wrote:

> Does this happen with all Outlook users that you send email to, or just
> some? Can you upgrade to a newer version of Pine, or isn't that possible?

It seems that this problem only happen when I reply to people. Not when I send
a new email. My version of Pine is 4.10. I could try to upgrade from 4.10 to
4.33 but I have not seen anything in the changelog regarding this issue.

> It sounds like this may be a Character-set discrepancy. I have
> experienced similar issues using Pine to send email to Outlook users, and
> the solution was to change my character-set from nothing to 'ISO-8859-1'.
> I don't know which one you'd be using, but that may be one thing you can
> try. I've found that if you don't specify a character-set in your Pine
> config, then send messages that include accented or other special
> characters, some users receive your message as type 'X-UNKNOWN', and
> display it as an attachment.
the character-set option was not set in my configuration. This is now changed.
I'll test it tomorow and I'll report the result... wait and see :)

> HTH!
thanks.

Gregoire Welraeds
<gregoire (at) welraeds (dot) be>

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From: Xavier Mertens <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Sort key per folder?
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Hi,

Is there a way to define a sort key per folder?
Ex: incoming -> thread
errors -> arrival date
etc...

X

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From: "Mike A. Harris" <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Sort key per folder?
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On Mon, 18 Jun 2001, Xavier Mertens wrote:

>Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 07:19:36 +0200 (CEST)
>From: Xavier Mertens <[email protected]>
>To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
>Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
>Subject: Sort key per folder?
>
>Hi,
>
>Is there a way to define a sort key per folder?
>Ex: incoming -> thread
> errors -> arrival date
> etc...

Very highly requested feature I believe. Available as a patch on
Eduardo Chappa's website. Search archives for the URL.

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Monday, June 18, 2001, 10:24:04 AM, Mike A. Harris wrote:

> Very highly requested feature I believe. Available as a patch on
> Eduardo Chappa's website. Search archives for the URL.

Not to be a PITA but is Pine development entered a coma ?

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From [email protected] Sun ??? 0 00:00:00 1970 +0000
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From: V V Raja Rao <[email protected]>
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Subject: incoming folders
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Hai,

I have tried to select and zoom(;,p,u,z) an incoming folder, but pine
says, the operation cannot be performed on incoming folders. Is there any
way to perform those operations on the incoming folders?

Thanks,
Raja.

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From: Eduardo Chappa <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: incoming folders
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*** V V Raja Rao ([email protected]) wrote in the pine-info list today:

:) I have tried to select and zoom(;,p,u,z) an incoming folder, but pine
:) says, the operation cannot be performed on incoming folders. Is there any
:) way to perform those operations on the incoming folders?

No, you can not check for new mail in incoming folders like that. You can,
however, press TAB when you are in any of thenm and that will make travel
through your remaining Incoming-Folders to check which one contains new
mail. You can also apply a patch available in my web page (address below)
which will notify you about new mail in your Incoming-Folders collection.

--
Eduardo
http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/

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From: Eduardo Chappa <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Sort key per folder?
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*** Xavier Mertens ([email protected]) wrote in the pine-info list today:

:) Is there a way to define a sort key per folder?
:) Ex: incoming -> thread
:) errors -> arrival date
:) etc...

No, you can apply a patch which you can find in my web page (called Define
your own rules...) which among other things allows you to do this. Get the
patch from my web page (adress below).

--
Eduardo
http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/

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From: <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: fail back from auth method to plaintext login?
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It seems that by design, pine will not allow failing back from a secure
authentication method to one that is insecure.

I can see how that might be good practice, especially on the internet as a
whole, but for an internal deployment of pine, it would seem that an
administrator should be able to configure the product to fail back to
plaintext, if they desire.

For example, I have pine compiled with kerberos support, and when people
have generated the appropriate tickets, they automatically authenticate to
the IMAP server and it all works just fine. Now, if for some reason they
haven't gotten themselves their kerberos tickets (and there is no other
secure authentication method enabled), then they can't log in at all, as
the only other method that can be used is plain-text which pine won't fall
back to using after a failed kerberos attempt. They then have to quite
pine, generate their kerberos tickets, and then run pine again.

Is this really necessary? Has anyone suggested adding a config switch to
allow administrators to turn on fall-back to plaintext authentication?

Thanks,
-Eric

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From: Eduardo Chappa <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: fail back from auth method to plaintext login?
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*** [email protected] wrote in the pine-info list today:

:) For example, I have pine compiled with kerberos support, and when
:) people have generated the appropriate tickets, they automatically
:) authenticate to the IMAP server and it all works just fine. Now, if for
:) some reason they haven't gotten themselves their kerberos tickets (and
:) there is no other secure authentication method enabled), then they
:) can't log in at all, as the only other method that can be used is
:) plain-text which pine won't fall back to using after a failed kerberos
:) attempt. They then have to quite pine, generate their kerberos tickets,
:) and then run pine again.
:)
:) Is this really necessary? Has anyone suggested adding a config switch
:) to allow administrators to turn on fall-back to plaintext
:) authentication?

You can get around this by disabling kerberos authentication, this is done
by adding

disable-these-authenticators=GSSAPI

in the person's .pinerc file.

--
Eduardo
http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/

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From: Eric Hagberg <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: fail back from auth method to plaintext login?
References: <Pine.EDO.4.33.0106181334300.31064-100000@goedel3.math.washington.edu>
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I'm aware of that setting, but using that means it won't use kerberos ever -
it doesn't fall back to plaintext while using kerberos if the tickets are
available and valid.

Eduardo Chappa wrote:

> *** [email protected] wrote in the pine-info list today:
>
> :) For example, I have pine compiled with kerberos support, and when
> :) people have generated the appropriate tickets, they automatically
> :) authenticate to the IMAP server and it all works just fine. Now, if for
> :) some reason they haven't gotten themselves their kerberos tickets (and
> :) there is no other secure authentication method enabled), then they
> :) can't log in at all, as the only other method that can be used is
> :) plain-text which pine won't fall back to using after a failed kerberos
> :) attempt. They then have to quite pine, generate their kerberos tickets,
> :) and then run pine again.
> :)
> :) Is this really necessary? Has anyone suggested adding a config switch
> :) to allow administrators to turn on fall-back to plaintext
> :) authentication?
>
> You can get around this by disabling kerberos authentication, this is done
> by adding
>
> disable-these-authenticators=GSSAPI
>
> in the person's .pinerc file.
>
> --
> Eduardo
> http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/

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From: Eduardo Chappa <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: fail back from auth method to plaintext login?
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*** Eric Hagberg ([email protected]) wrote today:

:) I'm aware of that setting, but using that means it won't use kerberos ever -
:) it doesn't fall back to plaintext while using kerberos if the tickets are
:) available and valid.

Eric,

My point is that you should use that configuration option for machines
that do not get tickets. You can do it through the command line or through
a pine.conf configurtion setting.

--
Eduardo
http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/

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From: Eric Hagberg <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: fail back from auth method to plaintext login?
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While a wrapper script could check for valid tickets and then run with the
command-line to disable the kerberos authentication... why not allow the fall-back
behavior to just work? There just doesn't seem to be a need to jump through those
hoops when the program could do it for you automatically.

Eduardo Chappa wrote:

> *** Eric Hagberg ([email protected]) wrote today:
>
> :) I'm aware of that setting, but using that means it won't use kerberos ever -
> :) it doesn't fall back to plaintext while using kerberos if the tickets are
> :) available and valid.
>
> Eric,
>
> My point is that you should use that configuration option for machines
> that do not get tickets. You can do it through the command line or through
> a pine.conf configurtion setting.

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From: Eduardo Chappa <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: fail back from auth method to plaintext login?
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*** Eric Hagberg ([email protected]) wrote today:

:) While a wrapper script could check for valid tickets and then run
:) with the command-line to disable the kerberos authentication... why
:) not allow the fall-back behavior to just work? There just doesn't
:) seem to be a need to jump through those hoops when the program could
:) do it for you automatically.

Dear Eric,

I agree with you, in the mean time I suggest that you use a different
pine.conf in each different machine to overcome this problem, and that's
really easy too.

--
Eduardo
http://www.math.washington.edu/~chappa/pine/

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From: Ed Arnold <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: fail back from auth method to plaintext login?
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Doesn't it make you just a *tiny* bit nervous that your users are
going to fall back to cleartext authentication ... perhaps without
even knowing what they're doing? Hasn't it been said that users
who don't understand the nature of their authentication method
are one of the biggest security risks?

It seems to me that you need to have an authentication method that
doesn't fail. If Kerberos is too complex for your users to
understand, perhaps you should use ssl/ssh or something else?

> While a wrapper script could check for valid tickets and then run with the
> command-line to disable the kerberos authentication... why not allow the fall-back
> behavior to just work? There just doesn't seem to be a need to jump through those
> hoops when the program could do it for you automatically.
>
> Eduardo Chappa wrote:
>
> > *** Eric Hagberg ([email protected]) wrote today:
> >
> > :) I'm aware of that setting, but using that means it won't use kerberos ever -
> > :) it doesn't fall back to plaintext while using kerberos if the tickets are
> > :) available and valid.
> >
> > Eric,
> >
> > My point is that you should use that configuration option for machines
> > that do not get tickets. You can do it through the command line or through
> > a pine.conf configurtion setting.

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Not really. Then again, I'm not in the security group here.

This is an application deployed entirely within a heavily-firewalled
environment. Given the fact that most of the time the kerberos
functionality will work (the users generally don't have to do anything
other than log into their desktop to get tickets), the occasional fall
back to text authentication inside our firewall isn't a big problem.

And they would certainly know that something different is going on - when
kerberos is working, they don't have to type their password at all.

-Eric

On Tue, 19 Jun 2001, Ed Arnold wrote:

EA> Doesn't it make you just a *tiny* bit nervous that your users are
EA> going to fall back to cleartext authentication ... perhaps without
EA> even knowing what they're doing? Hasn't it been said that users
EA> who don't understand the nature of their authentication method
EA> are one of the biggest security risks?
EA>
EA> It seems to me that you need to have an authentication method that
EA> doesn't fail. If Kerberos is too complex for your users to
EA> understand, perhaps you should use ssl/ssh or something else?

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From: Barry Landy <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Inability to change PINERC
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I have an odd effect and wonder if anyone else has seen it.
I am using the 4.32 OS/2 version, but cannot see that it can be OS
dependent.

I tried to change my Roles: I altered one of them and changed the order.
Tested my changes; all fine. Exited the Pine session and restarted Pine:
the Roles were just as they were before the changes.

Tried again - same.

I looked at Pinerc with an editor to try to understand the effect: I
find that the LIT: lines that define roles (and other things) occur in
TWO places and every single LIT: occurs exactly once in each place. My
suspicion is that version B is being written and version A read on
startup.

I have noticed this before and "cured" it by deleting one of the sets (a
bit experimental; delete the wrong set and all the settings vanish, even
though the other set are still in the file); I thought that had cured it
but obviously the dloubling has come back and must be being caused by
Pine itself.

Any clues or similar experiences?

--
Barry Landy Computer Laboratory:+44 1223 334600
192, Gilbert Road Direct line: +44 1223 334713
Cambridge CB4 3PB Home: +44-1223-570417
Email:[email protected]

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From: Jay Libove <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: PINE 4.33, Exchange, and IMAP logins not matching From/Return address
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Hello -

I have been a PINE user for many years, starting with using PINE just to
read mail from the local /var/spool/mail/ directory on a UNIX machine,
moving up to accessing remote mail stores, and these days I use it to
access my Exchange servers.

In one environment, where the user ID on the Exchange server matches an
email alias on the Exchange server, everything works fine.

In another environment however, I have to log in to the Exchange server
(using IMAP) with an ID string that looks like

DomainName/DomainUserID/ExchangeMailboxAlias

.. I can access the mailbox, but if I send mail, the return address has
that whole long ID string as the left side of the return email address
(That is, instead of having From: [email protected] as the return email
address in the message, I end up with
DomainName/DomainUserID/[email protected] which is
unreplyable).

Alternatively, I could set the login string (from which the From: is
generated) to My.Name, but then I have to manually type the
DomainName/DomainUserID/ExchangeMailboxAlias string repeatedly - at first
log in, and every time a folder is accessed on the Exchange server - so
that is not a practical workaround.

I remember a long time ago when PINE moved deliberately towards
disallowing the (ab)user to set their own From: line to make PINE less
useful to people who would fake email addresses, but unfortunately it
seems that I may need to do exactly that -- specify a different From:
address -- in order to be able to use PINE in this environment.

Any ideas please?

Thanks!
-Jay

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From: Emil Isberg <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: PINE 4.33, Exchange, and IMAP logins not matching From/Return
address
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On Wed, 20 Jun 2001, Jay Libove wrote:
>I remember a long time ago when PINE moved deliberately towards
>disallowing the (ab)user to set their own From: line to make PINE less
>useful to people who would fake email addresses, but unfortunately it
>seems that I may need to do exactly that -- specify a different From:
>address -- in order to be able to use PINE in this environment.

The hidden feature allow-changing-from changes so that you may set your
From: line again.

You just have to open your pinerc to add that line...
And then ofcourse add "From: Name <id@domain>" to customized-hdrs.

--
Polymer physicists are into chains.

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From: Jay Libove <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: PINE 4.33, Exchange, and IMAP logins not matching From/Return
address
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Hello Emil -

Thank you for that rapid answer!

I have two editions of PINE running -- one, PC PINE, which I installed from
the Washington.edu FTP server as a binary, and the other, on Linux which I
installed from the RedHat RPM. (I am capable of building PINE on Linux
myself, just lazy).

In neither of these two do I see the word "hidden" or "changing" in the
Setup -> Config. (I also checked the contents of ~/.pinerc on the Linux
installation).

Ahhh, I see - it REALLY is hidden -- that is, the configuration wizard in
PINE itself won't show it. I manually added it to the feature list in the
PC PINE pinerc file, added a From: header to the custom headers list,
restarted PINE, and away I go, happy.

(I got some help from the pine-info archive, where one single message
obliquely mentioned this feature without providing directions as to its
use).

Many thanks!
-Jay

-----Original Message-----
From: Emil Isberg [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2001 8:32 AM
To: Jay Libove
Cc: Pine Discussion Forum
Subject: Re: PINE 4.33, Exchange, and IMAP logins not matching
From/Return address

On Wed, 20 Jun 2001, Jay Libove wrote:
>I remember a long time ago when PINE moved deliberately towards
>disallowing the (ab)user to set their own From: line to make PINE less
>useful to people who would fake email addresses, but unfortunately it
>seems that I may need to do exactly that -- specify a different From:
>address -- in order to be able to use PINE in this environment.

The hidden feature allow-changing-from changes so that you may set your
From: line again.

You just have to open your pinerc to add that line...
And then ofcourse add "From: Name <id@domain>" to customized-hdrs.

--
Polymer physicists are into chains.

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From: Chris Drumgoole <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: kerberos and openssl conflicts?
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Hello,

I am trying to configure several email clients for a college network, and
I would like to include support for ssl and kerberos 5. We have mit
kerberos 5 1.06 and openssl 0.9.5. I found out from trying to configure
mutt, that there is a namespace conflict with libcrypto, thus, making it
impossible to install with both options unless we do one of three things.

1. upgrade kerberos to 1.1 or 1.2,
2. change the name of kerberos's libcrypto to libk5crypto
3. extract all objects from both libcryptos, and make one libcrypto

As pine is and will be our preferred/supported unix email client, can I
assume that one or all of these fixes will allow pine to work? (I think it
is a problem, because I can't even compile pine properly when enabling
those options).

Thanks for your help.

chris

<q

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From: Steve Hubert <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Nav Problem
In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>
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There is a hidden configuration feature "termdef-takes-precedence" which
should help.

--
Steve Hubert <[email protected]>
Networks and Distributed Computing, Univ. of Washington, Seattle

On Wed, 13 Jun 2001, Bill Andersen wrote:

> Hello All...
>
> I'm locked in to using an older system and have finally
> managed to get Pine working. The system is AIX 4.1.5.0
> and Pine is 4.10.
>
> Everything is working well, but I've run across a small
> problem with my Wyse50 terminals. I use a PC and terminal
> emulator to telnet to the AIX machine. My term is set
> to vt100 and my arrow keys will allow me to move the
> highlight bar between options. I was at one of my user's
> terminals yesterday and they were using "N" for next and
> "P" for previous (which is fine), but as a habit, they
> hit an arrow key to move around and got an error. The
> arrow keys are not functioning correctly in Pine. They
> work fine in our accounting software, so I've got to
> believe the terminal def is correct.
>
> Is there something in Pine 4.10 that would prevent "wyse50"
> TERM "type" from working correctly. Or is there a setting
> I'm missing in Pine?
>
> Not a real big thing, but I'd have some happy users if
> anyone can direct me to some info/FAQ on the matter...
>
> Thanks
>
> Bill
>
>
>

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From: Steve Hubert <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Sort key per folder?
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This will be in Pine4.40.

--
Steve Hubert <[email protected]>
Networks and Distributed Computing, Univ. of Washington, Seattle

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From: Mark Crispin <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: re: fail back from auth method to plaintext
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I have reviewed these messages.

The original complaint from [email protected] did not mention
what IMAP server they are using. Thus, I do not know what to make of the
claim that "the only other method that can be used is plain-text."

There is no such method as "plain-text". SASL (RFC 2222 authentication
protocol), via the IMAP AUTHENTICATE command, has two plaintext mechanisms,
one called PLAIN and one called LOGIN. Both are supported by Pine. There is
also the IMAP LOGIN command, which is pre-SASL and is heading towards
deprecation in the Internet standards process.

If the server offers the PLAIN and/or LOGIN SASL mechanism, then Pine will
fall back to these unless the user specified the "/secure" switch. I can
prove it with a trivial demonstration.

This behavior of /secure isn't a bug; it's a feature -- that's exactly what
/secure is defined to do and it's the only thing that /secure does.

If the server does not offer the PLAIN or LOGIN SASL methods, then no, Pine
will *not* fall back to the LOGIN command. Part of the design of the SASL
architecture that is OK to fall back to a different SASL authenticator, but
not to a pre-SASL method.

Put another way, a pre-SASL method may be used only if it is impossible to
attempt any form of SASL authentication; that is, if the server offers no SASL
mechanism that is known to the client.

In some protocols (e.g. SMTP and ACAP) SASL is the *only* method of
authentication, and as noted above the tendency in the Internet standards
process is to depreciate the pre-SASL methods such as the IMAP LOGIN

In conclusion, either Eric has configured Pine not to fallback to plaintext
(by using /secure), or his server is configured not to permit fallback to
plaintext (by not offering the LOGIN and/or PLAIN SASL mechanisms). Either
way, Pine can not override this configuration. If you think about it, you'd
understand why it can't.

-- Mark --

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From: Mark Crispin <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: kerberos and openssl conflicts?
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On Wed, 20 Jun 2001, Chris Drumgoole wrote:
> 1. upgrade kerberos to 1.1 or 1.2,
> 2. change the name of kerberos's libcrypto to libk5crypto
> 3. extract all objects from both libcryptos, and make one libcrypto
>
> As pine is and will be our preferred/supported unix email client, can I
> assume that one or all of these fixes will allow pine to work?

Either (1) or (2) will work. I've done both.

I don't know about (3), and given the amount of work involved I wouldn't
consider it.

-- Mark --

http://staff.washington.edu/mrc
Science does not emerge from voting, party politics, or public debate.

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From: Eric Hagberg <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: fail back from auth method to plaintext
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I haven't configured pine not to fallback. The server doesn't offer other SASL
methods.

Either way, pine can't do what I want it to today, without my changing the code,
which I have done (2 lines). If I had control over the imap server (it is a 1.6.x
Cyrus server), then perhaps I could do something about it, but I don't.

Mark Crispin wrote:

> In conclusion, either Eric has configured Pine not to fallback to plaintext
> (by using /secure), or his server is configured not to permit fallback to
> plaintext (by not offering the LOGIN and/or PLAIN SASL mechanisms). Either
> way, Pine can not override this configuration. If you think about it, you'd
> understand why it can't.
>
> -- Mark --

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From: Mark Crispin <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: fail back from auth method to plaintext
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On Thu, 21 Jun 2001 07:42:58 -0400, Eric Hagberg wrote:
> I haven't configured pine not to fallback. The server doesn't offer other
> SASL methods.

If the server does not offer a plaintext SASL method, then someone made the
decision not to allow plaintext authentication with a SASL-capable client.
That someone may be the server management, the guy who built the server, or
the server vendor.

The important point is that there *IS* a way in the SASL protocol for the
server to declare a policy of fallthough to plaintext authentication if secure
authentication fails. This is distinct from the way to declare a policy of
fallthrough to pre-SASL authentication if the client does not support any of
the SASL methods. For whatever reason, the server is doing the latter policy
but not the former policy. Pine is doing its job by properly implementing the
server's declared policy.

> Either way, pine can't do what I want it to today, without my changing the
> code, which I have done (2 lines).'

In effect, you have deliberately introduced a bug into Pine to ignore the
server's declared policy. You need to be aware that you have done this; and
that if the issue of Pine's non-compliance with policy comes up, it is because
of your local change.

Please remember to change the version number of Pine to have the "L" suffix,
in accordance with the the Pine license, so that it is clear that this version
of Pine has been locally modified.

Such labelling is particularly important when sites tamper with security
policy. When security incidents occur, people have a tendency to forget that
it happened because they disabled a security facility that would have
prevented it. "Convenience" is the cause of a great many security incidents,
and it's also a cause of amnesia when talk turn on "who to blame".

> If I had control over the imap server (it is a 1.6.x
> Cyrus server), then perhaps I could do something about it, but I don't.

If you don't have control over the server, then perhaps you aren't authorized
to override a policy that was decided by the server's management? If the
server's management isn't aware that they have done this, perhaps you need to
discuss this with them?

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From: Eric Hagberg <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: fail back from auth method to plaintext
References: <[email protected]>
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Strange that if I compiled pine with no kerberos support, then it would just use
plain text login. But you are saying that if I have compiled in kerberos support
and cause failure of that SASL method to fall back to a non-SASL method, then I am
doing something wrong.

Given the fact that a non-SASL-aware IMAP client can happily use the non-SASL
method for authentication, I don't see what is so wrong about allowing such
fallthough after the usable SASL methods have been exhausted.

Mark Crispin wrote:

> In effect, you have deliberately introduced a bug into Pine to ignore the
> server's declared policy. You need to be aware that you have done this; and
> that if the issue of Pine's non-compliance with policy comes up, it is because
> of your local change.

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From: Mark Crispin <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: fail back from auth method to plaintext
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On Thu, 21 Jun 2001 15:41:18 -0400, Eric Hagberg wrote:
> Strange that if I compiled pine with no kerberos support, then it would just
> use plain text login.

As I said in my previous two messages, there are two types of fallback:
1) fallback to pre-SASL LOGIN because the client and server do not have any
mutually-recognizable SASL methods.
2) fallback to a SASL plaintext method, because a secure SASL method failed.

These are completely independent of each other. There is separate protocol to
declare the availability of each type of fallback policy.

There is no such thing as "fallback to pre-SASL LOGIN because a secure SASL
method failed." If the server policy allows a fallback to plaintext because a
secure method failed, it will offer SASL plaintext as per fallback of type (2)
above. This provides the functionality of "fallback to plaintext" without the
harm of crossing the SASL/pre-SASL barrier. I will demonstrate that harm
later in this message.

Also as I stated before, your server is declaring that:
. fallback of type (1) is permitted, because it does not prohibit the
pre-SASL LOGIN command.
. fallback of type (2) is not permitted, because no SASL plaintext method is
offered.

> But you are saying that if I have compiled in kerberos support
> and cause failure of that SASL method to fall back to a non-SASL method,
> then I am doing something wrong.

Yes, I am. That is not a permitted fallback. It is harmful. Here's why.

I realize that the following is difficult to follow. It's a lot to absorb,
and it summarizes the accumulated wisdom of many years of hard knocks (as in
"been there, done that, got the T-shirt").

The reason is that a site may wish to allow the limited use of a known
insecure client, and thus not disable pre-SASL LOGIN. Thus, the site allows
fallback of type (1). At the same time, the site wishes to require that known
secure clients, such as Pine, never transmit plaintext passwords. Thus, the
site disallows fallback of type (2).

This is a common configuration, particularly in a transition to a fully secure
environment which prohibits all use of plaintext passwords. This transitional
configuration allows temporary ongoing use of insecure clients while
guaranteeing password confidentiality to users of secure clients.

Consider what happens if users of BlurdybloopMail are told to switch to Pine
because BlurdybloopMail does not have secure authentication. With the hacked
Pine, these users may still be using insecure authentication without knowing
it. It works for them during the transition period. They think they are fine
because they switched to Pine. The trap closes when the server disables
plaintext authentication. Suddenly, they're completely cut off. Their
opportunity to remedy the problem during the transition was lost; they never
knew they had a problem. Similarly, management was deceived into believing
that it could complete the transition. Now they have a major disaster on
their hands.

> Given the fact that a non-SASL-aware IMAP client can happily use the
> non-SASL method for authentication, I don't see what is so wrong about
> allowing such fallthough after the usable SASL methods have been exhausted.

What is wrong is that the hack breaks the guarantee that Pine, set by your
site's server policies, that SASL-capable Pine will not transmit a plaintext
password. At random, and without server authorization, the hacked Pine will
transmit plaintext passwords. There is no way to stop the hacked Pine from
transmitting plaintext passwords without disabling all plaintext passwords.
This breaks the ability of site management to have a graceful security
transition.

If you want Pine to be able to transmit plaintext passwords, the change to
make is in server policy; allow plaintext SASL methods.

The bottom line is that the hack choses short-term convenience over long-term
requirements. My advice is to eschew short-term convenience; its benefits are
fleeting, and dire punishment awaits those who disregard the long-term.

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From: Eric Hagberg <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: fail back from auth method to plaintext
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Mark Crispin wrote:

> What is wrong is that the hack breaks the guarantee that Pine, set by your
> site's server policies, that SASL-capable Pine will not transmit a plaintext
> password. At random, and without server authorization, the hacked Pine will
> transmit plaintext passwords. There is no way to stop the hacked Pine from
> transmitting plaintext passwords without disabling all plaintext passwords.
> This breaks the ability of site management to have a graceful security
> transition.
>
> If you want Pine to be able to transmit plaintext passwords, the change to
> make is in server policy; allow plaintext SASL methods.

The people who run the server have no intention of recompiling it or making
changes to it at this time, which would be necessary to change the server policy.
Since the group that runs the server in fact asked me to "fix" pine so that it
would work for people even if kerberos auth failed, I feel that my change is a
reasonable solution.

When the new server is being tested, I will be the one they'll come to to "fix"
pine again so that it works smoothly with their new backend, at which time I'll
try to make sure they make the right decisions regarding the authentication setup.

Thanks,
-Eric

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From: Mark Crispin <[email protected]>
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Subject: Re: fail back from auth method to plaintext
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It really does sound like you have no choice. But do yourself (or your
successor) a favor and keep good notes about what you did and why, as well
as the information I gave you. Hopefully it'll be as you say, and you'll
get to straighten things out and do the right thing while it's all fresh
in your mind. But hacks have a way of lasting longer than anyone
intended... [Sad experience here]

Good luck!

-- Mark --

http://staff.washington.edu/mrc
Science does not emerge from voting, party politics, or public debate.

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From: Bob Rasmussen <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Problem with display filters
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In Pine on Unix (up through 4.22), if I have a display filter set up, and I
print to "attached-to-ansi", I get some extra garbage in my print job.

Further analysis reveals that the "dfilter" routine does a ClearScreen both
before and after running the filter. But the printer is already open, so the
codes to clear screen end up going to the printer. This is bad.

It would appear that this would be fixed by not doing a ClearScreen (it is not
done in the Windows version), but what else would this break?

Any examples of uses of display filters?

Regards,
...Bob Rasmussen, President, Rasmussen Software, Inc.

personal e-mail: [email protected]
company e-mail: [email protected]
voice: (US) 503-624-0360 (9:00-6:00 Pacific Time)
fax: (US) 503-624-0760
web: http://www.anzio.com

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From: Bob Rasmussen <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: Multilingual (Unicode) Pine
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I have succeeded in making Pine (on Unix) output various charsets of incoming
messages as Unicode UTF-8, and am offering this description for others who
might be interested.

This technique makes use of the "iconv" utility, which is included in many
Linux distributions, and freely available. For our purposes, it will take data
in a variety of charsets and translate it to UTF-8. Here are the steps:

1. In Pine's configuration, set up display-filters for various charsets, such
as:
_charset(big5)_ ~/viewutf8 big5

2. In your home directory, create a shell script "viewutf8" with the single
line:
iconv --from-code=$1 --to-code=utf-8

3. As per my earlier-today message, a display filter interferes with
"attached" printing. You can solve this by using an outside program to handle
passthrough printing. My 'passthru' program (available on web site below) will
do this, but you must tell it to send its output to /dev/tty, so it doesn't go
back into Pine. Create a printer (in Pine) with the command
passthru > /dev/tty

This combination succeeds in outputting both display data and passthrough
print data in UTF-8, so accents, Russian, Chinese, etc. are correct. Assuming
your display/printing device can handle this. Some Linux consoles, and some
Xterm programs, can display data received as UTF-8.

We also have a Windows telnet client (Anzio Lite and AnzioWin) that can
display data received in UTF-8. AnzioWin can also passthru-print such data.
See web site for details.

Regards,
...Bob Rasmussen, President, Rasmussen Software, Inc.

personal e-mail: [email protected]
company e-mail: [email protected]
voice: (US) 503-624-0360 (9:00-6:00 Pacific Time)
fax: (US) 503-624-0760
web: http://www.anzio.com

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From: Nancy McGough <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: PINE 4.33, Exchange, and IMAP logins not matching From/Return
address
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On 20 Jun 2001 Jay Libove ([email protected]) wrote:
> Ahhh, I see - it REALLY is hidden -- that is, the configuration
> wizard in PINE itself won't show it. I manually added it to
> the feature list in the PC PINE pinerc file, added a From:
> header to the custom headers list, restarted PINE, and away I
> go, happy.
>
> (I got some help from the pine-info archive, where one single
> message obliquely mentioned this feature without providing
> directions as to its use).
>
> [ deleted ]
>
>> From: Emil Isberg [mailto:[email protected]]
>> The hidden feature allow-changing-from changes so that you may set your
>> From: line again.
>>
>> You just have to open your pinerc to add that line...
>> And then ofcourse add "From: Name <id@domain>" to customized-hdrs.

The problems you had figuring this out are related to my #1 and
#2 Pine wishes, which you can read here:

<http://www.ii.com/internet/messaging/pine/#wishFrom>

In the latest Pine (4.33), allow-changing-from defaults to on so
users no longer have to manually add that to their feature-list
(unless their sys admin has set it default to off) but I'd still
like to see my wish #1 and #2 incorporated into Pine. The first
thing I do when I walk someone through setting up a new Pine is
run it once so it creates a pinerc file and then close pine and
open the pinerc file with a text editor and change this

feature-list=

to this

feature-list=expose-hidden-config

Then I fire up Pine again and go to Main> Setup> Config (MSC) and
walk the person through all the configuration settings, including
the hidden ones!

If I'm setting a new Pine up for myself, I just copy my
pine.conf, pinerc, and pinercex files and edit the pinercex file
so it is correct for the current system. I talk about this at my
"Compartmentalizing and Sharing Your Pine Settings", which is
here:

<http://www.ii.com/internet/messaging/pine/sharing/>

^X,
Nancy
posted & cc'd

Infinite Ink (ii) Main Pine Page:
<http://www.ii.com/internet/messaging/pine/>

--
Nancy McGough <http://www.ii.com> Infinite Ink
=Sent via Pine 4.39.9: IMAP, NNTP & ESMTP for Unix/Win/Mac OS X=

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From: DIGITAL UNIX USER <[email protected]>
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Subject: --TECHNICAL DIFFERENCES--
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06.22.2001

A Quick Question: What are the "Technical" distinctions between Kreberos &
SSH? Thanks--Any advice is appreicated.

NOSPAM: <[email protected]>
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From: Marc Owen <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: 'sender'-checks by mailservers
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'lo,

I've had many bounces ('unresolvable host', etc) from several servers, and
after tracing the problem, it seemed those mailservers checked the existance
of the domain in the 'sender'-tag. This field is set by pine to the default
system domain, and is readonly; not customized header can be set for it. This
makes it impossible to send mails for me (and others, I presume) to several
servers from home, since I don't have a domainname or static internet
connection.

I understand the moral issue behind the idea not allowing the tag to be
changed, but still I think maybe this should be reconsidered; users are only left
with 3 choices:

- I can set my (fictious) domainname to something that actually exist,
thereby 'hijacking' somebody's domain and making it look like the mail originated
from that domain; this will make sending possible, but totally defeats the
point of making the variable read-only.
- I can ignore it, and try to live that more and more mailsystems bounce my
mail because of my fictious domain name.
- I can rewrite the code and patch it, so the sender-tag won't be added
/isn't readonly anymore. I chose this option (I have some programming knowledge,
but most people don't).

Maybe it's wise to include a compile-time option (alot like
allow-changing-local-from) that allows this for dailup (dynamic ip) users, and to mention
this in the documentation somewhere (it took a while for me to know the exact
cause).

Night,

Marc.

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From: Timothy Luoma <[email protected]>
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Subject: Re: 'sender'-checks by mailservers
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On Sun, 24 Jun 2001, Marc Owen wrote:

> I've had many bounces ('unresolvable host', etc) from several servers, and
> after tracing the problem, it seemed those mailservers checked the existance
> of the domain in the 'sender'-tag. This field is set by pine to the default
> system domain, and is readonly; not customized header can be set for it. This
> makes it impossible to send mails for me (and others, I presume) to several
> servers from home, since I don't have a domainname or static internet
> connection.

If this is the case, it is a really bad misuse of the 'Sender' field...
not that THAT's anything new, since people have been abusing that field
for some time now.

> - I can rewrite the code and patch it, so the sender-tag won't be added
> /isn't readonly anymore. I chose this option (I have some programming knowledge,
> but most people don't).

Yup, that's what I've been doing since around 3.96 or so, when I started
having problems with the Sender: field for various reasons. It's a
problem with PC-PINE though, since there's no code to hack.

TjL

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From: Jay Libove <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: 'sender'-checks by mailservers
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I am using PC PINE 4.33 with the allow-changing-from feature enabled and the
From: header customized, and my copy of PC PINE (stock, downloaded from U
Washington) does not set a Sender: header.
PINE 4.33 on Linux (RedHat RPM) also does not set a Sender: header for me,
not even when I set a different Reply-To: header.

So please pardon my ignorance, but when does PINE forcibly set a Sender:
header?

Thanks
-Jay

-----Original Message-----
From: Timothy Luoma [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Monday, June 25, 2001 12:30 AM
To: Pine Discussion Forum
Subject: Re: 'sender'-checks by mailservers

On Sun, 24 Jun 2001, Marc Owen wrote:

> I've had many bounces ('unresolvable host', etc) from several servers, and
> after tracing the problem, it seemed those mailservers checked the
existance
> of the domain in the 'sender'-tag. This field is set by pine to the
default
> system domain, and is readonly; not customized header can be set for it.
This
> makes it impossible to send mails for me (and others, I presume) to
several
> servers from home, since I don't have a domainname or static internet
> connection.

If this is the case, it is a really bad misuse of the 'Sender' field...
not that THAT's anything new, since people have been abusing that field
for some time now.

> - I can rewrite the code and patch it, so the sender-tag won't be added
> /isn't readonly anymore. I chose this option (I have some programming
knowledge,
> but most people don't).

Yup, that's what I've been doing since around 3.96 or so, when I started
having problems with the Sender: field for various reasons. It's a
problem with PC-PINE though, since there's no code to hack.

TjL

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From: Nancy McGough <[email protected]>
To: Pine Discussion Forum <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: 'sender'-checks by mailservers
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If you uncheck this feature in your feature list

[ ] use-sender-not-x-sender

Pine will not put a Sender header in messages you send. Instead
Unix Pine will use an X-Sender header and PC-Pine will use an
X-X-Sender header. Unfortunately, some spammers grab addresses
from these headers so the only way to protect yourself is to
patch the source. I have a link to TjL's no-sender patch on my
main Pine page and if I find out about any other ways to get
around this, I'll post the info on my site.

As TjL said, PC-Pine users are out of luck and w.r.t. removing
*Sender headers. You can kind of get around it by doing the
following three things:

1] put bogus info in your default From header and always use a
role when composing a message

2] set your default inbox-path to a throwaway account (e.g., I use
my operamail.com account which gets only spam).

3] whenever you post to a public forum, make sure the currently
open mailbox is a throwaway account

The Sender, X-Sender, and X-X-Sender headers seem to be
constructed from your currently open mailbox or your default From
header so that's why doing these 3 things can help to prevent
your real private email address from being posted to a public
forum. The problem is that inevitably I post to a public forum
with one of my private addresses showing up in my X-X-Sender
header so this is not a very good solution for me.

Another solution for PC users is to use Cygwin Pine and patch the
source.

^X,
Nancy

ii Main Pine Page: <http://www.ii.com/internet/messaging/pine/>

--
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